Extremism

[mogur]

And that is why you are a mod, PCL1.

And I get to hurl invectives and vitriol. Wait, just kidding, don't ban me.

I agree 100% that the strength of this board, our country, and any political system is based on a balance of views, from moderates to extremists, right and left, up and down, and every which way between. It is obvious that any extreme view to the exclusion of all others is potentially very dangerous.

What may be less obvious is that even moderate views can be detrimental without balance. And at least as risky is to allow the majority to run over the rights of minorities (no, not PC minorities). We need extremists- they sometimes are right (again, no, not rightists).

Shutting out anyone's voice is unwise and leads us down the road towards totalitarism. In that spirit, I celebrate O'Reilly's vitriol and Rush's invectives.

 

[Pandora]

Its painfully normal that people taking the time to post on these sorts of boards will be passionate and often further from the middle. If you are just noticing it here then you are not the norm. Out there in the interwebs its been this way for years.

I refer to most of the voting public as the mushy middle for a reason. They do not feel all that strongly about things and so are somewhat easlily tugged back and forth across the voting line.

The nation is not polarized as most people whould have you believe but the opposite ends of the political spectrum have been edging farther fro the center and taking greater interest in party politics which makes the politicians pay attention. Most are just trying to get through each day and as they feel no connection to government they pay it little mind. Their kids have a game to get to, gotta pay the bills and oh yeah, Idol's coming on in 20 minutes.

The left tend to run left into idealism while the right tend to focus on principle. You can make your own case for why either is good or bad.

The ratcheting you note has more to do with the massive expansion of government thats occurred over the last 75 years (or more). When it didn't impact your pocketbook so much you cared a little less. This has driven out of the mushy middle either because they are fed up with taxes increases or looking for a bigger hand out.

Will this ever change ? For the better ?

Who knows but tI do see a possibility in the (despite what the left would have you believe) broad based Teabag Movement. They are united on fiscal responsibility. Adn boy could we use some of that about now.

Most if not all the people I know in the mushy middle do not care about politics and often do not even bother to vote. But they can tell you everyone on the reality tv shows and who got voted off last week and who will probalby get voted off this week.

When asked what do you think about this topic or that, they hedge and sometimes give an answer but its never very solid. Mostly they dont want taxes to go up unless its going up on the other guy. Strange to me, they think I waste my time thinking, reading and talking politics but some how there is quality time spent in watching someone get voted off some show. I think most of them are why there are so many tv and radio ads during the election. People like us have our minds made up before the ads start and they are probably more swayed by them, and vote for the ad they heard the most.

 

[always]

Excellent responses. Some prove my point that there is an extreme polarization on this board, which I think, reflects a polarization among the nation at large. We have some members who identify themselves as "left" lumping some fairly diverse viewpoints together is "right wing", and some who identify themselves as right wing doing the same for the other side. Did I really read about Pandora being grouped together with ALWAYS? How do the two of you view that one?


Now, I've said this before, but I don't identify myself as middle, nor as left or right. I firmly reject the idea that politics is a one dimensional left to right continuum. Much of what is identified as "right wing" is really a militaristic and authoritarian point of view, which I personally firmly reject.
Some of my views are admittedly far from moderate.

Ive said this before, too, but I'll say it again: The forum would not be any good if everyone agreed. One of the best things about is being able to post one's thoughts secure in the knowledge that someone will think they're a pile of crap and tell you why, while others may applaud them. That makes for a great sounding board, IMO, but doesn't mean that someone who disagrees firmly is an idiot or ignorant, or any of the other epithets that keep getting hurled around. If someone sees things from a different perspective, that's great.

WELL, I , "ALWAYS , THE GREAT", appreciate the views expressed by PANDORA. We do not agree on everything BUT we most surely agree that radical leftist are dangerous and useless as they continue to try and destroy our FREE MARKET CAPITALISM SYSTEM and replace it with a fascist , communist , socialist , statist , Anti- God agenda.
One uninformed poster tried to say fascist , communist , socialist , statist , and other ANTI-GOD Isms must not be LUMPED together! LOL,LOL , How LOONY is that?? ENEMIES of AMERICA need not be battled individually BUT MUST BE DEFEATED IN MASS! A liberal is just as bad as a fascist , both want to HARM AMERICA and OUR CONSTITUTION!!
Just LOOK at innocent words like "HOPE " and "CHANGE ", very mild terms UNTIL they are used by FASCIST to DECEIVE A NATION . IE -2008 Elections.
I REST MY CASE!! STAY TOUGH . PANDORA!!

"ALWAYS" , "not for just a DAY, not for just a YEAR, BUT for ALWAYS"

 

[dogtowner]

Most if not all the people I know in the mushy middle do not care about politics and often do not even bother to vote. But they can tell you everyone on the reality tv shows and who got voted off last week and who will probalby get voted off this week.

When asked what do you think about this topic or that, they hedge and sometimes give an answer but its never very solid. Mostly they dont want taxes to go up unless its going up on the other guy. Strange to me, they think I waste my time thinking, reading and talking politics but some how there is quality time spent in watching someone get voted off some show. I think most of them are why there are so many tv and radio ads during the election. People like us have our minds made up before the ads start and they are probably more swayed by them, and vote for the ad they heard the most.

They almost always vote for the one who lines their pockets better. Sometime there are overriding issues such as security (2004), a poor message (Dole, McCain) but mainly its the money.

Please note that I only include voters in the mushy middle. The rest have rendered themselves moot. But honestly I'd rather they didn't bother if they are that removed from it.

 

[Pandora]

They almost always vote for the one who lines their pockets better. Sometime there are overriding issues such as security (2004), a poor message (Dole, McCain) but mainly its the money.

Please note that I only include voters in the mushy middle. The rest have rendered themselves moot. But honestly I'd rather they didn't bother if they are that removed from it.

I agree, I used to convince people to vote, my mother included. Then they voted for everything I am against and really could not explain why. Mostly voting with emotions instead of logic.

So those who dont care, I dont bother with.

I do though like talking to people who are really passionate for things I am against. I like hearing the other side very much

 

[Mare Tranquillity]

WELL, I , "ALWAYS , THE GREAT", appreciate the views expressed by PANDORA. We do not agree on everything BUT we most surely agree that radical leftist are dangerous and useless as they continue to try and destroy our FREE MARKET CAPITALISM SYSTEM and replace it with a fascist , communist , socialist , statist , Anti- God agenda.
One uninformed poster tried to say fascist , communist , socialist , statist , and other ANTI-GOD Isms must not be LUMPED together! LOL,LOL , How LOONY is that?? ENEMIES of AMERICA need not be battled individually BUT MUST BE DEFEATED IN MASS! A liberal is just as bad as a fascist , both want to HARM AMERICA and OUR CONSTITUTION!!
Just LOOK at innocent words like "HOPE " and "CHANGE ", very mild terms UNTIL they are used by FASCIST to DECEIVE A NATION . IE -2008 Elections.
I REST MY CASE!! STAY TOUGH . PANDORA!!

"ALWAYS" , "not for just a DAY, not for just a YEAR, BUT for ALWAYS"

Well, at least you're not an extremist. I asked before but you didn't answer: What is to be done the huge group of Americans who don't agree with you? You characterize them in viscious terms, it's obvious that you think that they should not be allowed to participate in the political system, but what is your suggestion for their disposal? How do we get rid of them?

Going just on the information you have posted, I have to guess that at least half the people in the US do not meet your standards. Pony up here, Al, what do you think we need to do with that 180 million Americans? Even if it's only a quarter of the population, what are we to do with that 90 million Americans?

 

[PLC1]

Well, at least you're not an extremist. I asked before but you didn't answer: What is to be done the huge group of Americans who don't agree with you? You characterize them in viscious terms, it's obvious that you think that they should not be allowed to participate in the political system, but what is your suggestion for their disposal? How do we get rid of them?

Going just on the information you have posted, I have to guess that at least half the people in the US do not meet your standards. Pony up here, Al, what do you think we need to do with that 180 million Americans? Even if it's only a quarter of the population, what are we to do with that 90 million Americans?

Actually, I think it's a lot more than half, but I await ALWAY'S answer to that one.

 

[top gun]

Well said TopGun

True love strikes again!

 

[Mr. Shaman]

OH, I think YOU are correct , The American VOTER has finnaly awakened and our Nation is surely DIVIDED. BUT , for once it is DIVIDED in such a way that "GOOD" is much larger and favorable than "EVIL". There is no doubt EVIL is represented by the majority of our National News Media except for Fox News , Conservative Talk Radio, and Conservative members of our Congress , regardless of Party.

Yeah....let's hear it for the "conservatives".

​

 

[Mr. Shaman]

....but I know of no conservative who is ashamed to be called conservative.

....Especially when Lobbyi$t$ make it so profitable to be "conservative".


​

 

[Mr. Shaman]

Our White House appointed Czars and other questionable characters to positions of power , positions that answer to noone but Obama. Their backgrounds are marxist, socialist , communist , everything and anything but FREE MARKET or CAPITALISM advocates.

Yeah....let's hear it for 8 years o' BUSHCO's FREE MARKET/CAPITALISM!!!

​

 

[Pandora]

....Especially when Lobbyi$t$ make it so profitable to be "conservative".


​

I am not talking about public figures, actually I would be wrong to say that about them. there are conservatives who are bashsed so hard by rino republicans they probably are ashamed to be conservative.

I meant in the real world of every day life.

 

[Mare Tranquillity]

I wonder about Mr. Always, he posts pretty harsh condemnations of people, but bails out when someone addresses his comments with valid questions.

I am one of the people that in just one post he accused of being "radical," "dangerous," "useless," "fascist, communist, socialist, statist, and anti-god". He went on to imply that I was uninformed and loony, that I must be defeated because I wish to harm the US and our Constitution. Yet he remains stubbornly silent about what should be done about me and the people like me who disagree with him. Are we to be deported? Killed? Enslaved? Sterilized and have our children taken from us to be re-educated in Conservative Camps?

As a business owning taxpayer with employees, as a law-abiding citizen who studies the issues and votes, as a firm believer in the Constitutional separation between Church and State and the equality of all people, I object to Mr. Always' attacks. Not because of the vitriol or the incessant stereotyping based on no real information, but rather because Mr. Always has nothing to offer but hot-air, name-calling, and denigrating comments about his fellow Americans. Not one single valid suggestion about what we can do to address the issue of the philosophical divide in this country, just continually adding more and more divisive and polarizing invective.

You come across as a blowhard, Mr. Always, with nothing of substance to contribute. Screeching invective never solved anything.

 

[ASPCA4EVER]

I wonder about Mr. Always, he posts pretty harsh condemnations of people, but bails out when someone addresses his comments with valid questions.

I am one of the people that in just one post he accused of being "radical," "dangerous," "useless," "fascist, communist, socialist, statist, and anti-god". He went on to imply that I was uninformed and loony, that I must be defeated because I wish to harm the US and our Constitution. Yet he remains stubbornly silent about what should be done about me and the people like me who disagree with him. Are we to be deported? Killed? Enslaved? Sterilized and have our children taken from us to be re-educated in Conservative Camps?

As a business owning taxpayer with employees, as a law-abiding citizen who studies the issues and votes, as a firm believer in the Constitutional separation between Church and State and the equality of all people, I object to Mr. Always' attacks. Not because of the vitriol or the incessant stereotyping based on no real information, but rather because Mr. Always has nothing to offer but hot-air, name-calling, and denigrating comments about his fellow Americans. Not one single valid suggestion about what we can do to address the issue of the philosophical divide in this country, just continually adding more and more divisive and polarizing invective.

You come across as a blowhard, Mr. Always, with nothing of substance to contribute. Screeching invective never solved anything.

As one that made the attempt to have an open discourse/discussion/exchange of ideologies with this poster {way back when he/she/it first showed up around here} our relationship hit the skids pretty quickly...but since Pandora {and ILK} has established a kinsmanship/supported/bolstered this problem child with continual kudos and Hail Mary's; 'ALWAYS' has only become more 'large & in charge' and feeds off of the support that is provided.

Since I've not made a secret of my location {ergo Rock Chock Jayhawk go KU, KS} has been on my posted page under my avatar...but recently in a conversation with another person, 'ALWAYS' discovered that I'm from Kansas, so now I'm being called Dr. Tiller the baby Killer. Notice the bizarre continue use of childish rhymes that this he/she/it utilizes...only leads me to believe that we are dealing with a 'mental midget' who has nothing better to do then SCREAM/RANT/RAVE as a spoiled child who needs constant attention from everyone. A couple of us have placed this problem on IGNORE and life has been much improved...doesn't stop the rhetoric but at least it's not so visible unless someone pulls the post into a quote and drags it all forward.

Ignore the child and it will 'ALWAYS' get bored and go away

 

[Mare Tranquillity]

As one that made the attempt to have an open discourse/discussion/exchange of ideologies with this poster {way back when he/she/it first showed up around here} our relationship hit the skids pretty quickly...but since Pandora {and ILK} has established a kinsmanship/supported/bolstered this problem child with continual kudos and Hail Mary's; 'ALWAYS' has only become more 'large & in charge' and feeds off of the support that is provided.

Since I've not made a secret of my location {ergo Rock Chock Jayhawk go KU, KS} has been on my posted page under my avatar...but recently in a conversation with another person, 'ALWAYS' discovered that I'm from Kansas, so now I'm being called Dr. Tiller the baby Killer. Notice the bizarre continue use of childish rhymes that this he/she/it utilizes...only leads me to believe that we are dealing with a 'mental midget' who has nothing better to do then SCREAM/RANT/RAVE as a spoiled child who needs constant attention from everyone. A couple of us have placed this problem on IGNORE and life has been much improved...doesn't stop the rhetoric but at least it's not so visible unless someone pulls the post into a quote and drags it all forward.

Ignore the child and it will 'ALWAYS' get bored and go away

I don't agree with Pandora on a point or two (or three or...) but my experience is that she is an honest debater and a capable thinker.

Always has not as yet demonstrated the faintest shred of intellectual curiousity or productive thought.