USA Is The Sponsor Of Dictatorships !

[Free Palestine]

Thanks for replying,

now can you please show me the surah in the Quran where it says that Allah (The God) asked Abraham to sacrifice Ismael. Please give me surah where they name Ishmael by his name.

The story is mentioned in Surah number 37 (called : Al Saffat) , and here is the origional text from Quran (in Arabic) :

"فبشرناه بغلام حليم ، فلما بلغ معه السعي قال يا بني إني أرى في المنام أني أذبحك فانظر ماذا ترى قال يا أبت افعل ما تؤمر ستجدني إن شاء الله من الصابرين ، فلما أسلما وتله للجبين ، وناديناه أن يا إبراهيم ، قد صدقت الرؤيا إنا كذلك نجزي المحسنين ،إن هذا لهو البلاء المبين ، وفديناه بذبح عظيم ، وتركنا عليه في الآخرين ، سلام على إبراهيم ، كذلك نجزي المحسنين ، إنه من عبادنا المؤمنين ، وبشرناه بإسحق نبيا من الصالحين " .​

Quran mentioned Ismael by name in many places and I can give to you if you want . But in the story where Abraham was asked to sacrifice, Ismael is mentioned as the son of Abraham . But it is clearely indicates that Allah meant Ismael NOT Isaac because in the second line (Aya) Allah says that he told Abraham that he will have another son and mentioned him by name (Isaac) which means clearely that the first was Ismael .
So , indicating Isaac to be another son who WILL COME proves that he didn't exist at that time when the story happened and proves that the son sacrified was Ismael .

This is a brief translation for what is mentioned in the text. If you want me to translate it in details, I am ready to do it.

In Addition, Mohammad mentioned that story and told us that he was Ismael by name . I am also ready to give you those evidences .

 

[rationalist]

The bible is not an historical text.

It is a book of fiction designed to make poor people poorer and more compliant so that the rich can dominate them.

The US is a religious fascist that bombs and kills Muslims because of how bad it is to bomb and kill people.

But the US only needs to regime change and or invade dictatorships (and elected governments) if they have a resource the US wants and they won't give it willingly.

The US sponsored Pinnochet into power as they did Saddam Hussein and the Taleban.

I think that makes them a sponsor of dictatorships.

 

[bododie]

The bible is not an historical text

Lol. Yeah, and Muhammad never even lied, he just took little girls as "wives". Lol.

It is a book of fiction designed to make poor people poorer and more compliant so that the rich can dominate them.

Do you think that Western Christians wrote the Bible? Lol.

Your statement is true of the Catholic Church which I think should go down in flames along with Islam. They are the two most stringent structured forms of religion.

See, now we can both be happy.

 

[rationalist]

All religions are equally ridiculous you religion facsist

 

[bododie]

religion facsist

???? In English please, I don't speak camel.

 

[rationalist]

That about sums you up

 

[bododie]

Snappy comeback.... Poor Rationalist, wants to bag on people about "religion", and loses the game because he can't realize that what he assumes about people is bull. Go ahead, get rid of religion. Who cares? Now what you gonna complain about? I mean that is what you guys who don't even have a tree to escape the dirt everywhere do for a living isn't it?

 

[Free Palestine]

The bible is not an historical text.

It is a book of fiction designed to make poor people poorer and more compliant so that the rich can dominate them.

The US is a religious fascist that bombs and kills Muslims because of how bad it is to bomb and kill people.

But the US only needs to regime change and or invade dictatorships (and elected governments) if they have a resource the US wants and they won't give it willingly.

The US sponsored Pinnochet into power as they did Saddam Hussein and the Taleban.

I think that makes them a sponsor of dictatorships.

You are right Rationalist , I do have the same opinion about that . The real bible which came from the God was a fair book which called for peace. But the bible we have today was re-written by the church monks in order to surve their way of thinking to rule the world.

 

[Free Palestine]

Lol. Yeah, and Muhammad never even lied, he just took little girls as "wives". Lol.

Please don't talk about Mohammad in this way. Islam as you might know gives the opportunity for the man to have up to 4 wives , and this is not something new in history . David who is the father of Jews had many wives as well . This is not the point , the point is to think in what Islam says and not in the wives of the prophet Mohammad . And to be clear , I think that having more than a wife but in a legal way is much better than christianity and christians today who have illegal sexual relations with hundreds of girls without having any duty towards them . Isn't it ??

 

[Gipper]

Please don't talk about Mohammad in this way. Islam as you might know gives the opportunity for the man to have up to 4 wives , and this is not something new in history . David who is the father of Jews had many wives as well . This is not the point , the point is to think in what Islam says and not in the wives of the prophet Mohammad . And to be clear , I think that having more than a wife but in a legal way is much better than christianity and christians today who have illegal sexual relations with hundreds of girls without having any duty towards them . Isn't it ??

Mohammad - peace be upon him, though he never practiced it.

You claim ALL Christians have illegal sex with hundreds of girls. WTH is that? I am a Christian and know many Christians. None did as you say.

Check out Man Love Thursdays. Now that is Muslim men committing disgusting and terrible actions against little boys and it is entirely legal. In most western nations this behavior is illegal. This on top of the horrendous treatment of women and non-Muslim people in the Muslim world. On top of the use of slavery in many Muslim countries. On top of honor killings, on top of beheading innocents, on top of suicide bombings of women and children, on top of murders committed daily somewhere in the world in the name of Allah, on top of .........

And you have the nerve to criticize Christians...

 

[Pandora]

The story is mentioned in Surah number 37 (called : Al Saffat) , and here is the origional text from Quran (in Arabic) :

"فبشرناه بغلام حليم ، فلما بلغ معه السعي قال يا بني إني أرى في المنام أني أذبحك فانظر ماذا ترى قال يا أبت افعل ما تؤمر ستجدني إن شاء الله من الصابرين ، فلما أسلما وتله للجبين ، وناديناه أن يا إبراهيم ، قد صدقت الرؤيا إنا كذلك نجزي المحسنين ،إن هذا لهو البلاء المبين ، وفديناه بذبح عظيم ، وتركنا عليه في الآخرين ، سلام على إبراهيم ، كذلك نجزي المحسنين ، إنه من عبادنا المؤمنين ، وبشرناه بإسحق نبيا من الصالحين " .​

Quran mentioned Ismael by name in many places and I can give to you if you want . But in the story where Abraham was asked to sacrifice, Ismael is mentioned as the son of Abraham . But it is clearely indicates that Allah meant Ismael NOT Isaac because in the second line (Aya) Allah says that he told Abraham that he will have another son and mentioned him by name (Isaac) which means clearely that the first was Ismael .
So , indicating Isaac to be another son who WILL COME proves that he didn't exist at that time when the story happened and proves that the son sacrified was Ismael .

This is a brief translation for what is mentioned in the text. If you want me to translate it in details, I am ready to do it.

In Addition, Mohammad mentioned that story and told us that he was Ismael by name . I am also ready to give you those evidences .

Thank you for posting the text in arabic, but its not helpful here... we need english.

I am posting the text from an online Quran. If you have a better translation please post it.




"He said: ‘I will go to my Lord! He will surely guide me! O my Lord! Grant me a righteous (son)!’ So we gave him the good news of a boy ready to suffer and forbear.

"Then, when (the son) reached (the age of) (serious) work with him, He said: ‘O my son! I see in a vision that I offer thee in sacrifice: Now see what is thy view!’ (The son) said: ‘O my Father! Do as thou art commanded: Thou will find me, if God so wills one practicing patience and constancy!’

"So when they had both submitted their wills (to God), and he had laid him prostrate on his forehead (for sacrifice), we called out to him, ‘O Abraham! Thou hast already fulfilled thy vision’ - thus indeed do we reward those who do right. For this was obviously a trial - And we ransomed him with a momentous sacrifice ..." (Surah 37:99-106).


The Quran never named what boy they are talking about but the Torah does.
The boy is very important I am sure we both agree.


God promised that it would be Isaac's descendants who would inherit the land given to Abraham. (Genesis 13:14-18, 15:18-21, 28:13-14). Ishmael had no part in the inheritance and promise given to Isaac through Abraham.


How do you reconcile that they never name the boy in your Quran but the text as old as the Dead Sea scrolls have named Isaac. Isaacs name is in print as the boy of promise long before your religion was invented

 

[OldTrapper]

Please don't talk about Mohammad in this way. Islam as you might know gives the opportunity for the man to have up to 4 wives , and this is not something new in history . David who is the father of Jews had many wives as well . This is not the point , the point is to think in what Islam says and not in the wives of the prophet Mohammad . And to be clear , I think that having more than a wife but in a legal way is much better than christianity and christians today who have illegal sexual relations with hundreds of girls without having any duty towards them . Isn't it ??

Do you know the difference between a wife, a mistress, and a concubine?

Genesis 16: 6-12

But Abram said unto Sarai, Behold, thy maid is in thine hand; do to her as it pleaseth thee. And when Sarai dealt hardly with her, she fled from her face.

7And the angel of the LORD found her by a fountain of water in the wilderness, by the fountain in the way to Shur.

8And he said, Hagar, Sarai's maid, whence camest thou? and whither wilt thou go? And she said, I flee from the face of my mistress Sarai.

9And the angel of the LORD said unto her, Return to thy mistress, and submit thyself under her hands.

10And the angel of the LORD said unto her, I will multiply thy seed exceedingly, that it shall not be numbered for multitude.

11And the angel of the LORD said unto her, Behold, thou art with child and shalt bear a son, and shalt call his name Ishmael; because the LORD hath heard thy affliction.

12And he will be a wild man; his hand will be against every man, and every man's hand against him; and he shall dwell in the presence of all his brethren.


Ishmael's brethren were the Arabs, not the Hebrews. And his personality seems quite fit for a Muslim although I see nothing that says he would be a prophet.

 

[Free Palestine]

Mohammad - peace be upon him, though he never practiced it.

You claim ALL Christians have illegal sex with hundreds of girls. WTH is that? I am a Christian and know many Christians. None did as you say.

Check out Man Love Thursdays. Now that is Muslim men committing disgusting and terrible actions against little boys and it is entirely legal. In most western nations this behavior is illegal. This on top of the horrendous treatment of women and non-Muslim people in the Muslim world. On top of the use of slavery in many Muslim countries. On top of honor killings, on top of beheading innocents, on top of suicide bombings of women and children, on top of murders committed daily somewhere in the world in the name of Allah, on top of .........

And you have the nerve to criticize Christians...

I didn't say ALL of christians. But this thing is spread in all christian countries with no exception . I have christian friends and I visited many Eupopean countries and I know that many christians do have illegal relations before marriage and they have many girlfriends and some go to the bars ...... . This is what I meant . And I said that against who claimed about prophet Mohammad as if All Islam is about having many wives ! . This is not true . Islam is a comprehensive way of living . And about Christianity , it is important to say that ALL muslims believe in the Christ and all muslims respect other religions which is an important Islamic instruction .

What you mentioned about Islamic countries and relations with boys is present but in very singular cases . This is forbidden in Islam and most muslims are stuck to that , but there is no perfect community as we all agree .

 

[Diamond]

I didn't say ALL of christians. But this thing is spread in all christian countries with no exception . I have christian friends and I visited many Eupopean countries and I know that many christians do have illegal relations before marriage and they have many girlfriends and some go to the bars ...... . This is what I meant . And I said that against who claimed about prophet Mohammad as if All Islam is about having many wives ! . This is not true . Islam is a comprehensive way of living . And about Christianity , it is important to say that ALL muslims believe in the Christ and all muslims respect other religions which is an important Islamic instruction .

This respect isn't practiced highly in the Arab world, is it?

 

[Free Palestine]

Thank you for posting the text in arabic, but its not helpful here... we need english.

You are welcomed . I know that you don't know Arabic but I posted the Arabic text to be origional from Quran for better proof ! .

I am posting the text from an online Quran. If you have a better translation please post it.

The translation is good . I think the meanings are right as they are translated .

"He said: ‘I will go to my Lord! He will surely guide me! O my Lord! Grant me a righteous (son)!’ So we gave him the good news of a boy ready to suffer and forbear.

"Then, when (the son) reached (the age of) (serious) work with him, He said: ‘O my son! I see in a vision that I offer thee in sacrifice: Now see what is thy view!’ (The son) said: ‘O my Father! Do as thou art commanded: Thou will find me, if God so wills one practicing patience and constancy!’

"So when they had both submitted their wills (to God), and he had laid him prostrate on his forehead (for sacrifice), we called out to him, ‘O Abraham! Thou hast already fulfilled thy vision’ - thus indeed do we reward those who do right. For this was obviously a trial - And we ransomed him with a momentous sacrifice ..." (Surah 37:99-106).


The Quran never named what boy they are talking about but the Torah does.
The boy is very important I am sure we both agree.

But you didn't translate all I wrote ,I wrote (Surah 37 : 99-112) , especilly 112 because Isaac is mentioned by name to be the second son of Abraham who will be born (i.e. is not present at the story time) which necessarily means that the boy mentioned in the story was NOT Isaac and surely he should be Ismael .


This is the text 112 and the translation :

وبشرناه بإسحاق نبيا من الصالحين​

translation : Allah says : After that (i.e. after the story) , I gave Abraham a surprise that he will have another son whose name is Isaac , and Isaac will be a prophet and a good man . ( Quran : Surah Al Saffat (37) : 112)

So Pandora, this is clear that Isaac was not even present when the story happened . In addition , Mohammad told us about the story and mentioned Ismael by name . So it is known for all muslims that he was Ismael .