On living together

[pocketfullofshells]

Liberals are declining in numbers.

Why would one want to minimize the differences ?

America does have enemies and sometimes all America does come together to fight them which is good and to be expected. Sometimes there is disagrement as to who those enemies are and there in less cohesion. That is normal as well.

Compromise is a tricky thing and not always good. Fortunately we have a wonderful Constitution to help us sort out where its called for and where it isn't.

white house

House

Senate

, Man its tough in this decline...winning all 3 branches...

but enjoy your 41 out of 100 Seats

 

[dogtowner]

white house

House

Senate

, Man its tough in this decline...winning all 3 branches...

but enjoy your 41 out of 100 Seats

and your team still can't get anything done.

if anyone doubted the existence of God, here's your proof.

(that's a joke, dont wig out).

 

[ktucan1]

You know what I find funny about this whole T. Jefferson thing. If this man was alive to day he would be raking in the millions. I mean for so many people to use his words and influence he would be laughing all the way to the bank. I wonder if he has any kin folk still around to maybe collect on all of this???You know what else. The Jefferson memorial is one of the least visited memorials in D.C. now that is sad.

 

[Bunz]

Libs and progressives are the ones causing all this warfare. If you would just accept the Constitution as the law of the land rather than letting libs/progressive elites rule us, we would get along just fine.

Conservatives believe the country is a nation of laws. Libs/progressives believe we are a nation ruled by the whims of elitist man and women.

There is no way we can find common ground.

Gipper, I disagree. I think it your disingenious statements here is good evidence that it has been the loud obstructionist movement of the right, moving further right that is causing the problem.

Id love for both parties to actually work together and create good working legislation to deal with the major problems facing America that we all have a vested interest in.

 

[Bunz]

Pretty bias post. You make it sound like conservatives are the problem. I can see where both are the problem and personally I think that liberals are more of the problem, but it does take two to tango... this post seems to say that conservatives ARE the problem and if you start the conversation that way, you are not going to get many conservatives to even give you or libs in general a chance.

A conservatives best bet is to speak louder and more often and do what they can to smash groups like acorn and take back seats in politics.

I agree more with this post than with Gippers. You hit the nail on the head to a point and that is that both sides are in bed together and they have to be. Because ultimately we are all Americans, and in reality we have a two party system, despite political parties not being mentioned in the Constitution, and warned against in the Washington Farewell Speech.

The right in this country is as responsible for any situation good or bad as the left. I think the difference is the outspoken members of the more far leaning members of any particular ideology.

 

[Bunz]

You can start by treating those with whom you disagree as equals rather than sub-humans. I'm no angel, I certainly have my faults in this area, as at least a couple of people are dying to point out as they read this, but I do put forth the effort to try and be a better person today than I was yesterday.

This is a good point, and I realise that you managed to dig up a few posts of a single member and I dont take issue with that, what is more at issue is one side calling the kettle black. Because I could easily post a few hundred posts to refute a judgement about a political leaning versus a few individuals who subscribe to similar views.
I have long enjoyed debate worthy discussions with those who I disagree with on a particular issue. It is a matter of judging an individual versus an ideology. Because if I judged everyone of your ideology based on a few individuals including media personalities that I wouldnt be having this conversation with you.

Such words inspire me. We should all push ourselves to achieve that level of tolerance and understanding when posting here on the forum. I don't see this as a competition, I'm not trying to defeat anyone in my arguments. I know some will think that's absurd but it's true... I will gladly explain and defend my views on any topic but I expect others to be able to do the same.

I have been swayed by rational arguments and I have swayed others through rational arguments but changing someone's mind is not my purpose for posting, I am here to learn and in doing so, I have met a couple dozen people from whom I have gained an intellectual profit.

When it comes to people with whom I disagree... We may not agree, we may not be able to arrive at a compromise, but if we can walk away with a better, clearer, fuller understanding of precisely what it is our opponents believe and why, then we both profit from the exchange.

When a forum has nothing to offer but massive internet ego's clashing in a childish battle not of ideas but of name calling, cheer-leading, finger-pointing and one-upsmanship, then we achieve nothing but intolerance and misunderstandings with no hope of civil discourse and no hope of mutual profit.

OK, bring on the attacks...

I dont disagree. While I dont think it would be a good idea in reality. It makes me wonder what a Thanksgiving dinner with the 30 or so core members that post here would be like.

 

[Bunz]

Liberals are declining in numbers.

Why would one want to minimize the differences ?

America does have enemies and sometimes all America does come together to fight them which is good and to be expected. Sometimes there is disagrement as to who those enemies are and there in less cohesion. That is normal as well.

Compromise is a tricky thing and not always good. Fortunately we have a wonderful Constitution to help us sort out where its called for and where it isn't.

I dont think you are going to see the base of the left go anywhere to be honest. While one might point to a few crazies who might have fled to Cuba or some other red herring, there is a large portion of America as evidenced by the major office holdings of democrats who want good affordable health care. Who want to have a choice in what happens to thier bodies. They dont want to engage in misguided wars based on severely misguided intelligence. This has not changed. This is on top of having realistic corporate responsibility policies and laws. Including taking common sense measures when it comes to protecting the environment.

 

[Bunz]

You know what I find funny about this whole T. Jefferson thing. If this man was alive to day he would be raking in the millions. I mean for so many people to use his words and influence he would be laughing all the way to the bank. I wonder if he has any kin folk still around to maybe collect on all of this???You know what else. The Jefferson memorial is one of the least visited memorials in D.C. now that is sad.

Not quite, because if he was alive today, or even during the civil war he would be broke and destitute without having the labor system based on slavery. I could go into a bunch of Native American issues as well but I will save them for another time.

That being said, I dont think the man is evil. Certainly he was a forward thinking man, of great knowledge. While I dont think we should disregard his words and actions privately and publicly. It is worthy to note that his actions involving early America were a response to monarchy and not communism.

 

[Capitalist Pig]

Is liberalism extremism?

If your point of reference is the constitution, then yes.

 

[Capitalist Pig]

Not quite, because if he was alive today, or even during the civil war he would be broke and destitute without having the labor system based on slavery. I could go into a bunch of Native American issues as well but I will save them for another time.

That being said, I dont think the man is evil. Certainly he was a forward thinking man, of great knowledge. While I dont think we should disregard his words and actions privately and publicly. It is worthy to note that his actions involving early America were a response to monarchy and not communism.

When reading the writings of Jefferson, it should be quite clear the sort of government that he sought to create. True, his enemy was the Brittish monarchy, but if he had wanted to replace that with benevolent centralized and inescapable power rather than the limited self government that we got, I think this would have been reflected in the speeches and writings attributed to him. The words of the founders are all pretty clear on the subject. You can argue that what they had to say then is no longer relevant, but you can't argue with any shred of legitimacy that they would have supported the kind of government that the liberals of today would like to create.

 

[dogtowner]

I dont think you are going to see the base of the left go anywhere to be honest. While one might point to a few crazies who might have fled to Cuba or some other red herring, there is a large portion of America as evidenced by the major office holdings of democrats who want good affordable health care. Who want to have a choice in what happens to thier bodies. They dont want to engage in misguided wars based on severely misguided intelligence. This has not changed. This is on top of having realistic corporate responsibility policies and laws. Including taking common sense measures when it comes to protecting the environment.

Y'all won't disappear of course, just pointing out that their numbers had dipped a little recently.

 

[always]

Gipper, I disagree. I think it your disingenious statements here is good evidence that it has been the loud obstructionist movement of the right, moving further right that is causing the problem.

Id love for both parties to actually work together and create good working legislation to deal with the major problems facing America that we all have a vested interest in.

"Working together" in a liberals mind is for his opponent to agree to support the liberal agenda! If not the liberal will CENSOR his opponents "Free Speech rights". WE see it daily even on this forum.

 

[always]

I agree more with this post than with Gippers. You hit the nail on the head to a point and that is that both sides are in bed together and they have to be. Because ultimately we are all Americans, and in reality we have a two party system, despite political parties not being mentioned in the Constitution, and warned against in the Washington Farewell Speech.

The right in this country is as responsible for any situation good or bad as the left. I think the difference is the outspoken members of the more far leaning members of any particular ideology.

The ONLY time you hear liberals say "we all must get along" is when they see their politicial power base eroding. Did YOU hear Pelosi , Reid, or Obama talk about "getting Along" with opponents to their radical liberal agenda in our present Congress. No, they lied , distorted, bribed , even their own party members to pass corrupt bills. BRUTE FORCE is the liberals weapon when they are in the majority!! ALL kinds of EVIL breaks out!
No, folks do not fall for their lies, when the sheep graze without a sheppard ,all kinds of bad things happen. Our Sheppard is known as a "Conservative Majority", POWER is the only thing Tyrants fear!! POWER of THE PEOPLE!! How to you compromise your Constitutional Freedoms? Which one do you allow the radical leftist to capture?
Look back over just the past twelve months, review the ugly mess Obama and his appointed czars , along with the democrat party majority in our Congress, it has been nothing less than a CRIME SPREE !How much more proof do you need? America was not FOUNDED on COMPROMISE and WILL NOT BE SAVED BY COMPROMISING OUR CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS!

 

[dogtowner]

Gipper, I disagree. I think it your disingenious statements here is good evidence that it has been the loud obstructionist movement of the right, moving further right that is causing the problem.

Id love for both parties to actually work together and create good working legislation to deal with the major problems facing America that we all have a vested interest in.

That would be nice but who exactly has seen to locking one side out of all partticipation in the process ? You may recall that this DID occur with the previous administration. Especially when it was attempting to inact un-Constitutional legislation like Medicare Rx and Amnesty.

 

[Revere]

The notion of collectivist solutions for individual problems is a false utopia.