Prove that God doesn't exist.

[Apathy]

Wrong. In fact is quite the opposite; I know more then I think I do. I have a vast amount of knowledge, only no vocabulary to explain it. I have observed much, but without the knowledge and terminology gained from a class in philosophy I am left to use my untrained voice. Very unfortunate, I find it, as it doesn't allow for the precision that is necessary for strong arguments.

You dont even know that you know nothing that is the sad part.

 

[Apathy]

Wrong. In fact is quite the opposite; I know more then I think I do. I have a vast amount of knowledge, only no vocabulary to explain it. I have observed much, but without the knowledge and terminology gained from a class in philosophy I am left to use my untrained voice. Very unfortunate, I find it, as it doesn't allow for the precision that is necessary for strong arguments. My previous post did a poor job of explaining my circumstances, but nevertheless it is impossible to truly telly everything I know. I'll put it frankly and say your assumption is wrong.

As for your edit... Everything is based on a certain set of assumptions and everyday to get through life you need to make these assumptions. Some things are beyond human understanding the existence or nonexistence of a god is one of them.

 

[MikeDBZ]

The existence of a god is not beyond human understanding. If one is to look at the very reasons they believe in a god then they will find that those reasons hold very little logical value and are merely beliefs satisfy two needs: the need for the truth and a need for comfort. Once one finds the truth, they find comfort. But the truth cannot be found without a little hard work and for most people, who are very busy, this hard work simply can't fit into their schedule. There is an easy way, a concept that allows for the comfort and truth in one efficient and time saving package. This package is religion and it appeals to everyone seeks truth and comfort. Is this truth real, no, but it sure is handy when you want to raise polite, respectful children. Religion and the belief in a god is a good example of how lazy people are today; when they can't simply open their eyes and look around them. OF course their are much more reasons for believing in a god, but I can't cover them all. Humans have the capacity to rationalize the nonexistence of god, but they simply choose not to, and no amount of ranting from me or others will convince them to act otherwise.

 

[Apathy]

The existence of a god is not beyond human understanding. If one is to look at the very reasons they believe in a god then they will find that those reasons hold very little logical value and are merely beliefs satisfy two needs: the need for the truth and a need for comfort. Once one finds the truth, they find comfort. But the truth cannot be found without a little hard work and for most people, who are very busy, this hard work simply can't fit into their schedule. There is an easy way, a concept that allows for the comfort and truth in one efficient and time saving package. This package is religion and it appeals to everyone seeks truth and comfort. Is this truth real, no, but it sure is handy when you want to raise polite, respectful children. Religion and the belief in a god is a good example of how lazy people are today; when they can't simply open their eyes and look around them. OF course their are much more reasons for believing in a god, but I can't cover them all. Humans have the capacity to rationalize the nonexistence of god, but they simply choose not to, and no amount of ranting from me or others will convince them to act otherwise.

This is not objective knowledge sorry try again...

 

[dogtowner]

The existence of a god is not beyond human understanding. If one is to look at the very reasons they believe in a god then they will find that those reasons hold very little logical value and are merely beliefs satisfy two needs: the need for the truth and a need for comfort. Once one finds the truth, they find comfort. But the truth cannot be found without a little hard work and for most people, who are very busy, this hard work simply can't fit into their schedule. There is an easy way, a concept that allows for the comfort and truth in one efficient and time saving package. This package is religion and it appeals to everyone seeks truth and comfort. Is this truth real, no, but it sure is handy when you want to raise polite, respectful children. Religion and the belief in a god is a good example of how lazy people are today; when they can't simply open their eyes and look around them. OF course their are much more reasons for believing in a god, but I can't cover them all. Humans have the capacity to rationalize the nonexistence of god, but they simply choose not to, and no amount of ranting from me or others will convince them to act otherwise.

lets keep it simple Mike, you make a number of assumptions that simply are not true, that's not unusual in a kid your age.

keep your eyes and mind open and perhaps the richness of time will help you see this. and perhaps read more. observati0n is great but it helps to see how others who do the same come to be able to describe.

 

[steveox]

And God didnt answer my Prayers cause the Ravens lost yesterday

Once again i prove GOD is a phony! I prayed again for my Ravens go to the superbowl. Again Pissburgh beats them. Same old bulls**t story over and over again and again. Its like watching an episode of Gilligans Island. Every time the professor comes up with a plan it ether fails or Gilligan screws it up. You see the castaways never get off the Island everytime they come close it fails. Just like Wile E Coyotae can never catch the Road Runner no matter how hard or how many times he tries to catch that road runner he never catches it. Prayers never get ansewed the whole bible is also a phony its all B.S! Even Penn Jillette will tell you the bible is full of B.S!!

Mark 11:24:

Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours

John 14, verses 12 through 14

"Truly, truly, I say to you, he who believes in me will also do the works that I do; and greater works than these will he do, because I go to the Father. Whatever you ask in my name, I will do it, that the Father may be glorified in the Son; if you ask anything in my name, I will do it.

I want to experance the Superbowl in person. I wanna be out the Stadium a watching it instead of watching it on TV. Superbowl event is like going to a whitehouse dinner and eatting with the president. Now they only people can do that is, The President and his family Members And members of Congress or the Senate and their family members. Now i dont know anybody personaly in govenment so im not invited to a whitehouse dinner. You have to be invited to a whitehouse dinner. And attending the presidential inauguration you have to be invited by a whitehouse staff or the presidents family to experance the inauguration. Samething with the superbowl your team has to be in it in order to experance the superbowl. Samething with any sporting championship game. Like In baseball my Orioles have to get in the World Series in order for me to watch it at the Stadium. This is where i wanna sit in the Superbowl

Not sitting here watching it

And i wanna get my hands on these

So therefor the Bible is B.S!!

 

[nobull]

Christians by far are the most obnoxious people ever in the history of the fracking planet. Why should we listen to you and as you say "drop it" we were having a nice conversation before you poked your head in. We are big boys and girls I think we can decide for ourselves whether or not we want to continue the conversation

Sorry..

regards
doug

 

[nobull]

I'm only 18 years old, but at a younger age I was thrown aside in social life. I went from being the kid who talked to the kid who listened. I went from being the person who acted to he kid who observed. It was after several years of observing and analyzing the humans in my social environment that I realized that the existence of a god was simply not true. But also I realized that in order to disprove this god I would need the sophisticated and objective evidence that so many crave. Unfortunately, using the adjectives and verbs of my vocabulary is not enough to describe the very thoughts that my brain has processed in order to come to the conclusion that God does not exist. Over time though, I realized that I didn't need to disprove his existence; he simply didn't exist. It disappoints me (but mostly angers me) to see the amount of human being who poison themselves with the delusion of a god, simply because they cannot accept (or comprehend) the truths of this universe. I understand how the belief in a god goes down to the depths of psychology and the cognitive mind, I understand that people who work very pointless and repetitive jobs need a reason to get up every morning, I understand that people who miss their loved ones need assurance that they'll meet again, I understand that people need something to make them sleep at night. I understand the thirst of the human mind and it's quest for the truth. Unfortunately, people choose the truth that brings them comfort, not the truth that is necessarily real. I just wish people would give up all this religious non-sense and maybe there would be peace in this world.

The fact of the matter that some (deliberately?) don't seem to grasp is that truth/reality- by definition- IS 'narrow' and absolute.

I actually had someone once tell me in all seriousness that the moon only exists when she can see it!

Personal perception isn't necessarily truth because reality doesn't change if we don't like or understand or are wrong about what we see:

Truth is true, even if no one knows it.

Truth is true, even if no one admits it.
Truth is true, even if no one believes it.

Truth is true, even if no one follows it.

Truth is true, even if it isn't popular.
Truth is true, even when others attempt to distort it.

Truth is true, even if no one but God understands it fully.



doug

 

[Apathy]

The fact of the matter that some (deliberately?) don't seem to grasp is that truth/reality- by definition- IS 'narrow' and absolute.

I actually had someone once tell me in all seriousness that the moon only exists when she can see it!

Personal perception isn't necessarily truth because reality doesn't change if we don't like or understand or are wrong about what we see:

Truth is true, even if no one knows it.

Truth is true, even if no one admits it.
Truth is true, even if no one believes it.

Truth is true, even if no one follows it.

Truth is true, even if it isn't popular.
Truth is true, even when others attempt to distort it.

Truth is true, even if no one but God understands it fully.



doug

Considering your god has damned us all at birth Im in no mood for his endless riddle. How am I to pray to a murderer for forgiveness?

 

[dogtowner]

And God didnt answer my Prayers cause the Ravens lost yesterday

Once again i prove GOD is a phony! I prayed again for my Ravens go to the superbowl. Again Pissburgh beats them. Same old bulls**t story over and over again and again. Its like watching an episode of Gilligans Island. Every time the professor comes up with a plan it ether fails or Gilligan screws it up. You see the castaways never get off the Island everytime they come close it fails. Just like Wile E Coyotae can never catch the Road Runner no matter how hard or how many times he tries to catch that road runner he never catches it. Prayers never get ansewed the whole bible is also a phony its all B.S! Even Penn Jillette will tell you the bible is full of B.S!!

Mark 11:24:

Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours

John 14, verses 12 through 14

"Truly, truly, I say to you, he who believes in me will also do the works that I do; and greater works than these will he do, because I go to the Father. Whatever you ask in my name, I will do it, that the Father may be glorified in the Son; if you ask anything in my name, I will do it.

I want to experance the Superbowl in person. I wanna be out the Stadium a watching it instead of watching it on TV. Superbowl event is like going to a whitehouse dinner and eatting with the president. Now they only people can do that is, The President and his family Members And members of Congress or the Senate and their family members. Now i dont know anybody personaly in govenment so im not invited to a whitehouse dinner. You have to be invited to a whitehouse dinner. And attending the presidential inauguration you have to be invited by a whitehouse staff or the presidents family to experance the inauguration. Samething with the superbowl your team has to be in it in order to experance the superbowl. Samething with any sporting championship game. Like In baseball my Orioles have to get in the World Series in order for me to watch it at the Stadium. This is where i wanna sit in the Superbowl

Not sitting here watching it

And i wanna get my hands on these

So therefor the Bible is B.S!!

if you want to go to the superbowl then just go, there is nothing stopping you.

 

[steveox]

Your team has to be in it. Its like an invitation to a white house dinner. You cant just walk up to the gate and say,I like to eat dinner with the president,You gotta be invited. If your team isnt in the super bowl theres no reason you should be there.

 

[nobull]

Considering your god has damned us all at birth Im in no mood for his endless riddle. How am I to pray to a murderer for forgiveness?

First..Why are you so angry?? As a skeptic or atheist you are governed by two main principles: 1) all beliefs must be supported by observational evidence, and 2) beliefs that contradict observational evidence cannot be tolerated. However, strong atheism states that there is no god, even though observational evidence indicates that the universe has a cause that cannot be detected observationally. So despite the lack of observational evidence for a naturalistic cause for the universe, the strong atheist believes that the universe has a naturalistic cause and that there is no god, contradicting the tenet that all beliefs should be based upon observational evidence.

doug

 

[Apathy]

First..Why are you so angry?? As a skeptic or atheist you are governed by two main principles: 1) all beliefs must be supported by observational evidence, and 2) beliefs that contradict observational evidence cannot be tolerated. However, strong atheism states that there is no god, even though observational evidence indicates that the universe has a cause that cannot be detected observationally. So despite the lack of observational evidence for a naturalistic cause for the universe, the strong atheist believes that the universe has a naturalistic cause and that there is no god, contradicting the tenet that all beliefs should be based upon observational evidence.

doug

Those principles do not apply to me.

 

[nobull]

Considering your god has damned us all at birth Im in no mood for his endless riddle. How am I to pray to a murderer for forgiveness?

The laws of physics must have values very close to those observed or the universe does not work "well enough" to support life. What happens when we vary the constants? The strong nuclear force (which holds atoms together) has a value such that when the two hydrogen atoms fuse, 0.7% of the mass is converted into energy. If the value were 0.6% then a proton could not bond to a neutron, and the universe would consist only of hydrogen. If the value were 0.8%, then fusion would happen so readily that no hydrogen would have survived from the Big Bang. Other constants must be fine-tuned to an even more stringent degree. The cosmic microwave background varies by one part in 100,000. If this factor were slightly smaller, the universe would exist only as a collection of diffuse gas, since no stars or galaxies could ever form. If this factor were slightly larger, the universe would consist solely of large black holes. Likewise, the ratio of electrons to protons cannot vary by more than 1 part in 1037 or else electromagnetic interactions would prevent chemical reactions. In addition, if the ratio of the electromagnetic force constant to the gravitational constant were greater by more than 1 part in 1040, then electromagnetism would dominate gravity, preventing the formation of stars and galaxies. If the expansion rate of universe were 1 part in 1055 less than what it is, then the universe would have already collapsed. The most recently discovered physical law, the cosmological constant or dark energy, is the closest to zero of all the physical constants. In fact, a change of only 1 part in 10120 would completely negate the effect.

Universal probability bounds"Unlikely things happen all the time." This is the mantra of the anti-design movement. However, there is an absolute physical limit for improbable events to happen in our universe. The universe contains only 1080 baryons and has only been around for 13.7 billion years (1018 sec). Since the smallest unit of time is Planck time (10-45 sec),5 the lowest probability event that can ever happen in the history of the universe is:

1080 x 1018 x 1045 =10143

So, although it would be possible that one or two constants might require unusual fine-tuning by chance, it would be virtually impossible that all of them would require such fine-tuning. Some physicists have indicated that any of a number of different physical laws would be compatible with our present universe. However, it is not just the current state of the universe that must be compatible with the physical laws. Even more stringent are the initial conditions of the universe, since even minor deviations would have completely disrupted the process. For example, adding a grain of sand to the weight of the universe now would have no effect. However, adding even this small amount of weight at the beginning of the universe would have resulted in its collapse early in its history.LOL.. LOL.. I just believe, but what has been said here is fact..

doug

 

[Apathy]

The laws of physics must have values very close to those observed or the universe does not work "well enough" to support life. What happens when we vary the constants? The strong nuclear force (which holds atoms together) has a value such that when the two hydrogen atoms fuse, 0.7% of the mass is converted into energy. If the value were 0.6% then a proton could not bond to a neutron, and the universe would consist only of hydrogen. If the value were 0.8%, then fusion would happen so readily that no hydrogen would have survived from the Big Bang. Other constants must be fine-tuned to an even more stringent degree. The cosmic microwave background varies by one part in 100,000. If this factor were slightly smaller, the universe would exist only as a collection of diffuse gas, since no stars or galaxies could ever form. If this factor were slightly larger, the universe would consist solely of large black holes. Likewise, the ratio of electrons to protons cannot vary by more than 1 part in 1037 or else electromagnetic interactions would prevent chemical reactions. In addition, if the ratio of the electromagnetic force constant to the gravitational constant were greater by more than 1 part in 1040, then electromagnetism would dominate gravity, preventing the formation of stars and galaxies. If the expansion rate of universe were 1 part in 1055 less than what it is, then the universe would have already collapsed. The most recently discovered physical law, the cosmological constant or dark energy, is the closest to zero of all the physical constants. In fact, a change of only 1 part in 10120 would completely negate the effect.

Universal probability bounds"Unlikely things happen all the time." This is the mantra of the anti-design movement. However, there is an absolute physical limit for improbable events to happen in our universe. The universe contains only 1080 baryons and has only been around for 13.7 billion years (1018 sec). Since the smallest unit of time is Planck time (10-45 sec),5 the lowest probability event that can ever happen in the history of the universe is:

1080 x 1018 x 1045 =10143

So, although it would be possible that one or two constants might require unusual fine-tuning by chance, it would be virtually impossible that all of them would require such fine-tuning. Some physicists have indicated that any of a number of different physical laws would be compatible with our present universe. However, it is not just the current state of the universe that must be compatible with the physical laws. Even more stringent are the initial conditions of the universe, since even minor deviations would have completely disrupted the process. For example, adding a grain of sand to the weight of the universe now would have no effect. However, adding even this small amount of weight at the beginning of the universe would have resulted in its collapse early in its history.LOL.. LOL.. I just believe, but what has been said here is fact..

doug

Hoyle's fallacy...