Obama Administration: 50-100 GITMO Detainees cannot be tried or released

[Dr.Who]

Ton's...really...I posted about the most recent 5 that a Judge told G.W.B. that they had to release for failure to provide any substantial PROOF of terrorist activity...but TONS have been released???

The finite reasoning about "justifiable under the law at the time" is the reason that this has to be investigated to it's fullest...there seems to be veritable gradient shades of gray spread over what was accurately documented, what was the proper language/verbiage used for the reasoning/authority provided, and the truth of 'WHAT WAS REALLY' going on.

Standing before and against the wrongs of this activity is what America needs to do...clean our own house before we start lecturing other countries on what & how to handle their malcontents...IMO. This has given us a serious BLACK EYE and we need to rectify the wrongs that were done/how they managed to circumvent the manual on torture/who signed off on these poor judgmental decisions/and get the the bottom of this in order to assure that it will never happen again...IMO

Exactly three high level detainees were given the harsher interrogation techniques that may or may not have been torture and the result was that a terrorists attack on LA was thwarted. Voluminous guidelines were followed in the process to ensure that the scumbag's were not permanently harmed, did not actually have their religious ideals violated, and that the unpleasantness was short in duration.

I would say that any spy or terrorist would be very lucky to be captured by the US compared to most of the countries on this planet. We follow rules and have not violated our laws.

Meanwhile Saadam gasses whole villages, china forces women to have abortions, hutus slaughter tutsis (or vice versa) while the gov looks the other way, Egypt commits real torture and not "torture light", Russian has mass graves, etc.

Yes the US still retains the right to lecture others about human rights. Except perhaps that we kill, what, 600,000 unborn living humans every year largely for convenience.

 

[Pandora]

Exactly three high level detainees were given the harsher interrogation techniques that may or may not have been torture and the result was that a terrorists attack on LA was thwarted. Voluminous guidelines were followed in the process to ensure that the scumbag's were not permanently harmed, did not actually have their religious ideals violated, and that the unpleasantness was short in duration.

I would say that any spy or terrorist would be very lucky to be captured by the US compared to most of the countries on this planet. We follow rules and have not violated our laws.

Meanwhile Saadam gasses whole villages, china forces women to have abortions, hutus slaughter tutsis (or vice versa) while the gov looks the other way, Egypt commits real torture and not "torture light", Russian has mass graves, etc.

Yes the US still retains the right to lecture others about human rights. Except perhaps that we kill, what, 600,000 unborn living humans every year largely for convenience.

Excellent points Dr. Who!

If I ever get arrested for being a terrorist, I hope it’s by the USA (under any other administration besides this one hat is…) I think this administration might behead me for being a right wing extremist.

 

[BigRob]

Ton's...really...I posted about the most recent 5 that a Judge told G.W.B. that they had to release for failure to provide any substantial PROOF of terrorist activity...but TONS have been released???

We started releasing them in 2004. Within the place there are really 3 camps. Camp Delta, Camp Iguana, and Camp X-Ray. Camp X-Ray was closed in 2002. Camp Delta is the bigger camp housing something like 620 people. As you are aware I am sure when President Obama ordered the place to close we were holding 245 or so people I believe it was. That is a reduction of quite a few people, and there are plenty of stories out there talking about how people were released. Remember the whole Pentagon report focused on how many of them went back to fighting us? They had to be released in order to even have this problem to begin with.

The finite reasoning about "justifiable under the law at the time" is the reason that this has to be investigated to it's fullest...there seems to be veritable gradient shades of gray spread over what was accurately documented, what was the proper language/verbiage used for the reasoning/authority provided, and the truth of 'WHAT WAS REALLY' going on.

What was going on was in accordance with the law and in accordance with oversight from Congress.

Standing before and against the wrongs of this activity is what America needs to do...clean our own house before we start lecturing other countries on what & how to handle their malcontents...IMO. This has given us a serious BLACK EYE and we need to rectify the wrongs that were done/how they managed to circumvent the manual on torture/who signed off on these poor judgmental decisions/and get the the bottom of this in order to assure that it will never happen again...IMO

The US rarely lectures people on how they treat their malcontents. We make some noise here and there, but we often do little, if anything, about it.

Your demand to go back post facto after the law has been changed and then attempt to try people under this in my view is a flagrant violation of the Constitution. I will tell you that the Executive will have had long legal discussions on the issue and clear OLC decisions backing up what they were doing. Trying to bring that down in court is nearly impossible.

 

[Dr.Who]

If I ever get arrested for being a terrorist, I hope it’s by the USA (under any other administration besides this one hat is…) I think this administration might behead me for being a right wing extremist.

Why? Do you have a Ron Paul bumper sticker?

 

[ASPCA4EVER]

Rob said: The US rarely lectures people on how they treat their malcontents. We make some noise here and there, but we often do little, if anything, about it.

Rob...come on...we {the USA} are always telling other nations what they should and shouldn't be doing on their own Human Rights Issues...We butt our nose in quite often. Want to trade commodities with us...you'd better get your 'human rights issues up to snuff'...it's always been a bargaining tool to use to manipulate other countries to bend to our will!

Rob said: Your demand to go back post facto after the law has been changed and then attempt to try people under this in my view is a flagrant violation of the Constitution. I will tell you that the Executive will have had long legal discussions on the issue and clear OLC decisions backing up what they were doing. Trying to bring that down in court is nearly impossible.

You have your opinion about what should be done and I have mine...it's the Great American Way! But you don't know anything for sure...you weren't privy to those executive meetings you weren't provided the documentation for supporting the 'new applications' for torture...so all you have is just conjecture and HOPE that they did all that needed to be done and it was above board and legally processed...ME...cynic that I am...I DOUBT THAT EVERYTHING WAS DONE ABOVE BOARD AND LEGALLY PROCESSED!

While I can stand on the imperial soap box {yes, I do have on} and firmly resolutely state that I have G.W.B.'s & Companies track record for the ability to stretch the truth and remold it into something that suits their purpose and they tell us what we 'need' to hear not what we should have heard. That's my reaction for G.W.B. lying to start this fiasco! Grounds for suspicion...and now I'm suspicious!

 

[ASPCA4EVER]

Dr. Who: I do not really know if any of the so called wrongly accused are still there or have been held for a long time.

But what I do know is that in your long rebuttal to Rob you fail to provide any statement whatsoever that any of the so called wrongly accused are still there or being held there for a long time.

Gee, I know that the 'Devil Is In The Details' but maybe re-reading the post and paying particular attention to the 'DATES' might enlighten your reading/comprehension skills...other then that...I can't help you...

Clipped from the article: Saar volunteered for Guantanamo Bay in 2002. He was a U.S. Army linguist, an expert in Arabic, with a top-secret security clearance. He was assigned to translate during interrogations. The prisoners, about 600 in all, were mostly from the battlefields of Afghanistan. And Saar couldn’t wait to get at them after what the administration said: the men were "among the most dangerous, best-trained, vicious killers on the face of the earth

Yes, it really is tough to take a mans word for what took place over there, from one who volunteered to provide his specialist service for & too his country and then have you blow it off as 'JUST A 60 MINUTE' show, now that is a slap to our honorable service people.

But the truth is out there somewhere...some of us want it all uncovered...some of you fear the results and want to keep the dirt buried...I'm not so geared that way!

 

[BigRob]

Rob...come on...we {the USA} are always telling other nations what they should and shouldn't be doing on their own Human Rights Issues...We butt our nose in quite often. Want to trade commodities with us...you'd better get your 'human rights issues up to snuff'...it's always been a bargaining tool to use to manipulate other countries to bend to our will!

Selectively at best. Just look at China, Saudi Arabia, the list can go on and on of large trading partners that commit gross human rights violations.

You have your opinion about what should be done and I have mine...it's the Great American Way! But you don't know anything for sure...you weren't privy to those executive meetings you weren't provided the documentation for supporting the 'new applications' for torture...so all you have is just conjecture and HOPE that they did all that needed to be done and it was above board and legally processed...ME...cynic that I am...I DOUBT THAT EVERYTHING WAS DONE ABOVE BOARD AND LEGALLY PROCESSED!

Well, taking a look at the public record and the released torture memos, I have based my opinions on that. Sure people will arrive at different conclusions, and there is nothing wrong with that persay, until we want to launch a witch hunt for what has so far has not been shown to be illegal.

While I can stand on the imperial soap box {yes, I do have on} and firmly resolutely state that I have G.W.B.'s & Companies track record for the ability to stretch the truth and remold it into something that suits their purpose and they tell us what we 'need' to hear not what we should have heard. That's my reaction for G.W.B. lying to start this fiasco! Grounds for suspicion...and now I'm suspicious!

Well suspicious is fine, but in my view to go after a sitting President and attempt to charge his administration with something we need something a little more solid than "suspicion."

 

[BigRob]

Yes, it really is tough to take a mans word for what took place over there, from one who volunteered to provide his specialist service for & too his country and then have you blow it off as 'JUST A 60 MINUTE' show, now that is a slap to our honorable service people.

But the truth is out there somewhere...some of us want it all uncovered...some of you fear the results and want to keep the dirt buried...I'm not so geared that way!

As I pointed out, in January there were less than 250 prisoners remaining in the camp. That is a decline of roughly 350 prisoners.

Further, no one is attempting to "slap" our service people. However, the official records put out by the administration and the Congressional briefings give a much larger picture than one man's involvement. It is not a disservice to anyone to ask for the entire picture, and not simply rely on one man's perceptions.

 

[ASPCA4EVER]

Well suspicious is fine, but in my view to go after a sitting President and attempt to charge his administration with something we need something a little more solid than "suspicion."

G.W.B. isn't sitting anywhere but in Texas...he's gone and until the whole thing unfolds and everything is looked at you'll take a stand that what they release is factual...OK, so you buy into that, I don't!

And it just isn't '60 Minutes' that has been running reports about the 'suspicious' goings on...and
'60 Minutes' have run quite a few segments about the detainees...but one only has to google for the information and there is plenty out there to read & view!

 

[BigRob]

G.W.B. isn't sitting anywhere but in Texas...he's gone and until the whole thing unfolds and everything is looked at you'll take a stand that what they release is factual...OK, so you buy into that, I don't!

Hah, true, he is no longer the sitting President. However, why would the Obama administration forge documents to support the Bush story?

 

[Pandora]

Why? Do you have a Ron Paul bumper sticker?

nah but I got NOBAMA written in the dirt on the back of my Ford Explorer. I cant bare to wash it off. Oh yes and a pink Palin sticker just to make sure I get flipped off at least once a day

So except for that and my not being a Vet, I fit the profile

 

[ASPCA4EVER]

Hah, true, he is no longer the sitting President. However, why would the Obama administration forge documents to support the Bush story?

If in your wild imagination you've driven off of the road and into the ditch with what and with whom I've been talking about then you really, really haven't been paying attention. And that last statement doesn't merit a direct response...due to the absolute divergence from the topic matter!

 

[BigRob]

If in your wild imagination you've driven off of the road and into the ditch with what and with whom I've been talking about then you really, really haven't been paying attention. And that last statement doesn't merit a direct response...due to the absolute divergence from the topic matter!

Well you did say that you are not going to believe everything that is released is factual. So it stands to reason why would the Obama administration be forging documents to cover for them, especially since they (the Bush people) are all out of power and are not going to be forging anything themselves.

 

[ASPCA4EVER]

Well you did say that you are not going to believe everything that is released is factual. So it stands to reason why would the Obama administration be forging documents to cover for them, especially since they (the Bush people) are all out of power and are not going to be forging anything themselves.

OOOOh...'putem up'...{pulling on my boxing gloves}...LOL

I'm not saying that the current administration has fabricated anything...I'm saying that since the prior administration seems to have been caught 'fabricating the WMD' that they seem to have polished the ability to be less then forthright/honest in providing factual documentation.

As for as our current administration goes...historically speaking...it'll take them another elected 4 years in office to be able to screw up the 'system'. Not everyone can have a 'Darth Chaney' for VP. This time around we have 'DUDLEY DO-WRIGHT' of Biden for VP...some one needs to find that 'pull cord' attached to his neck and clip that string...every time Biden gets a microphone moment...he pulls that voice cord and within nanoseconds he's spewed some 'stupid ****'...STUPID BUT NOT EVIL as with 'DARTH CHANEY'!

 

[Pandora]

I'm not saying that the current administration has fabricated anything...I'm saying that since the prior administration seems to have been caught 'fabricating the WMD' that they seem to have polished the ability to be less then forthright/honest in providing factual documentation.

Some video links to clips of democrats and what they have said since the 90s about Iraq. One of my favorites was by John Freaking Kerry (who served in Vietnam) but its not on this first clip


AlGore getting on the first President Bush for not dealing with Iraq


John Freaking Kerry (who served in Vietnam) admitting WMD had been
found in the past in Iraq


AlGore: No Doubt Saddam's Weapons Are Grave Threat


This clip is comedy, the first part is democrat gidgets saying Iraq has WMD and must be taken down the second half of the clip is saying Bush is bad for thinking Iraq had WMD.



In closing, if you think the Bush administration fabricated anything... It seems disingenuous of you if you don’t agree that Dems were right there with him. There are so many other clips of other Dems insisting that Iraq had WMD but you get the general idea