I'm amused by the discussion of "freedom" in health care

[AtheismIsReality]

One of the battle cries against health care reform is "freedom." We can't let the government get involved with health care because it will take away our freedom.

Yet, government has been involved in health care for a long time. One of the things our government has mandated is that everyone receives emergency care regardless of ability to pay.

Where was all the whining about freedom in regard to that? Why weren't all the freedom loving people marching on DC and demanding that health care providers not be placed into slavery and forced to absorb the expense of those who cannot pay for treatment?

 

[rationalist]

And what about the freedom of the poor?

Is it freedom to have to have to choose between food and healthcare?

What I find most fascinating about this subject is that the most vehemently opposed to free healthcare for all are right wing christians who seem to display an inordinate lack of love for their fellow man.

 

[Mr. Shaman]

One of the battle cries against health care reform is "freedom." We can't let the government get involved with health care because it will take away our freedom.

Yet, government has been involved in health care for a long time. One of the things our government has mandated is that everyone receives emergency care regardless of ability to pay.

Where was all the whining about freedom in regard to that? Why weren't all the freedom loving people marching on DC and demanding that health care providers not be placed into slavery and forced to absorb the expense of those who cannot pay for treatment?

They tried....they tried....those "conservative"-icons with special-psychic-powers:​

“If you don’t stop Medicare, and I don’t do it, one of these days you and I are going to spend our sunset years telling our children and our children’s children what it once was like in America when men were free.”

​

 

[Mr. Shaman]

And what about the freedom of the poor?

Is it freedom to have to have to choose between food and healthcare?

What I find most fascinating about this subject is that the most vehemently opposed to free healthcare for all are right wing christians who seem to display an inordinate lack of love for their fellow man.

What you're missing, is....Our clerics know better than the neighbors' Clerics.​

"On October 17, 2004 the CBC aired the first part of The Greatest Canadian television series. In it, the bottom 40 of the top 50 "greatest" choices were revealed, in order of popularity, determined by polls conducted by E-mail, Web site, telephone, and letter. To prevent bias during the second round of voting, the top ten nominees were presented alphabetically rather than by order of first round popularity.

This second vote was accompanied by a series of documentaries, where 10 Canadian celebrities acting as advocates each presented their case for The Greatest Canadian. Voting concluded on November 28 at midnight and the following evening, November 29, the winner was revealed to be Tommy Douglashttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Greatest_Canadian#Top_10."

 

[Dr.Who]

One of the battle cries against health care reform is "freedom." We can't let the government get involved with health care because it will take away our freedom.

Yet, government has been involved in health care for a long time. One of the things our government has mandated is that everyone receives emergency care regardless of ability to pay.

Where was all the whining about freedom in regard to that? Why weren't all the freedom loving people marching on DC and demanding that health care providers not be placed into slavery and forced to absorb the expense of those who cannot pay for treatment?

Technically you are correct. Those who value freedom should complain when anyone's freedom is restricted even the freedom of hospitals.

Nevertheless, it is true that some freedoms have been lost and many more will be lost if this goes through.

 

[AtheismIsReality]

Technically you are correct. Those who value freedom should complain when anyone's freedom is restricted even the freedom of hospitals.

Nevertheless, it is true that some freedoms have been lost and many more will be lost if this goes through.

Is that a bad thing?

 

[Mr. Shaman]

Nevertheless, it is true that some freedoms have been lost and many more will be lost if this goes through.

Whew....that's quite The List you provided.


​

 

[Dr.Who]

And what about the freedom of the poor?

Is it freedom to have to have to choose between food and healthcare?

What I find most fascinating about this subject is that the most vehemently opposed to free healthcare for all are right wing christians who seem to display an inordinate lack of love for their fellow man.

You are correct that those who make choices in life that lead to the inability to pay have exercised freedom. I respect everyone's right to make poor choices. I am willing to help after they have.

Yes the freedom to choose between food and healthcare is the same for all of us. I a world where a catastrophic illness can cost a billion dollars to treat almost every one of us could find ourselves in that exact situation. We should never forget that he purpose of insurance is not to provide health care but to provide protection against financial loss.

And what about those who are unable to pay not due to their own choices? All of us might find ourselves in that position. And the OP was right that there is a system to address that issue so that not a single person in the US will ever go without care due to an inability to pay.

No one is advocating that the poor be left without health care. People are saying that if they are going to take advantage of the welfare system that they not have their own money with which to pay. In other words welfare is for the poor not for those with money. Seems like commons sense.

Unlike the notion that the people who oppose "free" health care (it is not free) are right wing Christians. Reality - people who oppose it come from many walks of life. And since there is not a single person in the US who cannot have access to health care there is no lack of love on that account.

 

[Dr.Who]

Is that a bad thing?

Yes. The loss of freedom is a bad thing. It is also contrary to our constitution.

 

[AtheismIsReality]

Yes. The loss of freedom is a bad thing. It is also contrary to our constitution.

Which part are you citing?

 

[Dr.Who]

Which part are you citing?

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/How_does_the_Constitution_protect_individual_rights

 

[AtheismIsReality]

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/How_does_the_Constitution_protect_individual_rights

I've addressed the issue before.

The there is no constraint in the tenth that says the people may not empower their national government to handle an issue as Congress is granted the specific power to make policy for the general welfare. If there is a constraint, please point it out.

The underlying theory of our government says the just powers of the government come from the consent of the governed. Yes, I do believe I read that somewhere.

 

[Andy]

And what about the freedom of the poor?

Is it freedom to have to have to choose between food and healthcare?

What I find most fascinating about this subject is that the most vehemently opposed to free healthcare for all are right wing christians who seem to display an inordinate lack of love for their fellow man.

That's because most of the left is too ignorant to realize the poor in our country get better health care than those in socialized countries.

Left wing atheists will harm the poor far more than we do, as they have in the past.

 

[Mr. Shaman]

Nevertheless, it is true that some freedoms have been lost and many more will be lost if this goes through.

Whew....that's quite The List you provided.


​

Tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick,.....

Ya' find that extensive-list, yet, Dr.Who???????????

​

 

[Mr. Shaman]

And what about the freedom of the poor?

Is it freedom to have to have to choose between food and healthcare?

What I find most fascinating about this subject is that the most vehemently opposed to free healthcare for all are right wing christians who seem to display an inordinate lack of love for their fellow man.

....But, LOVE that free-market!!!!!!!!!!!!​

"Most recently, Robertson disgusted many with a call for the assassination of Venezuelan President Hugo Chávez, then denying that he made the comment, and then apologizing for making the comment. Robertson called the democratically elected leader of oil-rich Venezuela a "dictator" that the US government should "take out."

What Robertson didn’t disclose was that his oil-related investments are really what fuel his animosity for Chávez.

Robertson’s business interests are less well known than his big mouth. His investments and business schemes have been mostly funded through Operation Blessing and his other "charities," his television show, The 700 Club, and his TV "network" the Christian Broadcasting Network.

From donation$ provided by viewers, Robertson bought the Family Channel, sold part of its stock at a personal profit of $90 million, and then sold the rest to right-wing media mogul and FOX owner Rupert Murdoch for $1.82 billion.

In two swift financial deals, Robertson and his family took in ten$ of million$ of dollar$ in pure profits on the backs of desperate, deluded faith-filled viewers. No money was disbursed to the viewers who made Robertson's millions from these deals possible.

Operation Blessing, also financed entirely through charitable donations from Robertson's cult following, has proved to be a more shaky financial venture for Robertson. First, he used the airplane and resources brought in by Operation Blessing to fly to Zaire (Democratic Republic of the Congo) to purchase diamond mines for Robertson’s company African Development Corporation, to harvest so-called blood diamonds produced by near slave labor.

Interestingly, Robertson’s diamond venture shows that he really doesn’t have a problem with dictators per se – as long as he can make some money from them. To win diamond mining rights, Robertson developed a close and friendly relationship with dictator Mobutu Sese Seko, most notorious for his collaboration with the CIA in the assassination of Congolese national liberation movement leader Patrice Lumumba in 1961.

According to a 1996 interview with a former pilot for Operation Blessing, of 40 flights to Zaire in the mid-1990s, only one or two were really related to the humanitarian work that Operation Blessing claimed to its donors would be its main work. The rest, the pilot admitted, were related to developing the blood diamond business."