Do you think the expression gay for stupid is offensive and incorrect word usage?

[Pandora]

I think you're missing the point. In common language, "homosexual" and "gay" have become synonyms - while there are plenty of people who are aware that "gay" started out meaning something else and became a slang term, today the two words have come to mean the same thing. One of the hazards of a living language - the language evolves and changes over time.

Part of that change is that "gay" has begun to be a pejorative for "stupid" or "negative." Homosexuals don't appreciate that for obvious reasons. They probably didn't much appreciate the application of the word "gay" to them, but it began in the 1920s and flourished in the 40s, 50s, and 60s - which, with the exception of the last, were not decades that were heavily tolerant to homosexuality. Back then, had they protested being called something they didn't like, they'd have been declared to have a mental disorder (which was how homosexuality was viewed prior to the 70s). By the time the homosexual population began to have a voice, "gay" was insinuated into standard English, and they chose to own it for themselves - perhaps in the ironic way that many Native Americans prefer to be referred to as Indians. For whatever reason, that's their choice - as it is their choice to protest usage of their self-identifying monikor as a pejorative phrase. I support that choice as an ardent supporter of homosexual rights.

This is a rather ridiculous debate topic. Just take a look at the thread title: "Do you think the expression gay for stupid is offensive and incorrect word use?" In order to answer that, the best thing you can do is ask someone who is gay, and see what they have to say.

All I can do is disagree with you. But I respect your right to believe how you want. Hopefully I have the same right to believe as I do.

I saw a student in my school get suspended for saying “oh that’s so gay” talking about some project he didn’t want to do. I disagree with the school for the actions. The kid was not in any way talking about or referring to homosexuals. What he said was like saying “that’s so boring, or that’s so lame “I don’t agree with being overly sensitive to some but not to others.

Anyway, that’s all I have to say on this topic

 

[dahermit]

"...The term gay actually means, bright and pleasant or promoting a feeling of cheer. .." Therefore, to use the word "Gay" for the meaning of homosexual is incorrect.

 

[PLC1]

History of the word gayThe word gay has been used to refer to homosexuals since the 1800s. Originally it was more understood by gays themselves than by straights. So it could be a way of talking about being gay without saying you were homosexual. By the 1980s though, most people knew the alternate meaning of the word gay was homosexual.

From Wickipedia: http://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gay#History_of_the_word_gay

 

[r0beph]

My whole point is that while whether it is offensive or otherwise, I have no real argument, it is, to those the word's homonymic definition applies to, for obvious reasons. My argument is purely on the grounds of is it incorrect, no word is incorrect unless the meaning is a misinterpretation of the word. The use of gay in discourse to refer to something objectionable to the caller was intentional, and most definitely not an accidentally misusage of malconstruction based on an improper assumption of the words definition. Incorrect is using 'insure' to 'ensure someone of something,' or the all too common incorrect use of irony, all too common today, but gay, no it was intentional and not 'incorrect'. Unless by incorrect you incorrectly meant to say "morally objectionable" in which case, I'll give you that, although I could suggest some other words to use in its place in future subject along these lines.

 

[vyo476]

I saw a student in my school get suspended for saying “oh that’s so gay” talking about some project he didn’t want to do. I disagree with the school for the actions. The kid was not in any way talking about or referring to homosexuals. What he said was like saying “that’s so boring, or that’s so lame “I don’t agree with being overly sensitive to some but not to others.

And I suppose people began using the term "gay" in a derogatory sense, connotating uselessness and/or stupidity, as an extension of the first definition, "excessively happy"?

No. People began using the word "gay" in a negative sense when "gay" became an adjective describing homosexual behavior. It's quicker and easier than saying "That's so homosexual" and comes with a built-in ambiguity to justify its continued usage. Maybe that kid didn't realize he was poking fun at homosexuals - the discrimination becomes subconscious - but any homosexuals who heard him knew exactly what was going on.

That said, a suspension is a bit heavy-handed; recognition of what I've outlined and a relative slap on the wrist (purely metaphorically speaking, of course) probably would have sufficed - and actually taught him the appropriate lesson, rather than just punishing him without really explaining why he was being punished.

 

[r0beph]

And I suppose people began using the term "gay" in a derogatory sense, connotating uselessness and/or stupidity, as an extension of the first definition, "excessively happy"?

No. People began using the word "gay" in a negative sense when "gay" became an adjective describing homosexual behavior. It's quicker and easier than saying "That's so homosexual" and comes with a built-in ambiguity to justify its continued usage. Maybe that kid didn't realize he was poking fun at homosexuals - the discrimination becomes subconscious - but any homosexuals who heard him knew exactly what was going on.

That said, a suspension is a bit heavy-handed; recognition of what I've outlined and a relative slap on the wrist (purely metaphorically speaking, of course) probably would have sufficed - and actually taught him the appropriate lesson, rather than just punishing him without really explaining why he was being punished.

The problem is that since this is current and in a reverse evolutionary order than the use of "Black" to refer to evil/bad and then the latter usage of black to refer to those of african decent. This has a negative connotation, however do to the progression of the word evolution it is not considered such Now had the original sense been to refer to those of african descent and the moved into meaning evil / bad / difficult I assure you the same arguments would be used for this as you are for the word gay, however it takes a moment of thought to see quite simply, they are the same however it goes. The meaning of words, not how they got there is central to their scope, language is as such, attempting to stifle evolution of language is a silly and futile effort...

 

[vyo476]

The problem is that since this is current and in a reverse evolutionary order than the use of "Black" to refer to evil/bad and then the latter usage of black to refer to those of african decent. This has a negative connotation, however do to the progression of the word evolution it is not considered such Now had the original sense been to refer to those of african descent and the moved into meaning evil / bad / difficult I assure you the same arguments would be used for this as you are for the word gay, however it takes a moment of thought to see quite simply, they are the same however it goes. The meaning of words, not how they got there is central to their scope, language is as such, attempting to stifle evolution of language is a silly and futile effort...

The connotation of negativity surrounding the color "black" predates anti-African bigotry and stems most probably from the perception of night being a dangerous time. A lot of old school religions also taught fear of dark places, especially dense forests and caves. Black, darkness, the lack of light, etc. are all ancient symbols which, in a metaphorical sense, teach people to fear the unknown. It is fairly easy to distinguish between people who use that form of symbolism and people who make reference to "black" or its synonyms in a negative context while referring to those of dark skin (whether they be Africans, African Americans, Caribbean islanders, etc.). The latter is clearly unacceptable, but the former, those symbolic usages of darkness, while not necessarily progressive are at least tolerable.

The connotation of negativity surrounding the word "gay" stems entirely from homophobia. That's where it came from, no question about it. There's no historical, metaphorical, or linguistic value in "gay" meaning "stupid." It is bigotry made common language.

 

[r0beph]

The connotation of negativity surrounding the color "black" predates anti-African bigotry and stems most probably from the perception of night being a dangerous time. A lot of old school religions also taught fear of dark places, especially dense forests and caves. Black, darkness, the lack of light, etc. are all ancient symbols which, in a metaphorical sense, teach people to fear the unknown. It is fairly easy to distinguish between people who use that form of symbolism and people who make reference to "black" or its synonyms in a negative context while referring to those of dark skin (whether they be Africans, African Americans, Caribbean islanders, etc.). The latter is clearly unacceptable, but the former, those symbolic usages of darkness, while not necessarily progressive are at least tolerable.

The connotation of negativity surrounding the word "gay" stems entirely from homophobia. That's where it came from, no question about it. There's no historical, metaphorical, or linguistic value in "gay" meaning "stupid." It is bigotry made common language.

Just for historical note, Black in reference to dark skinned persons stems from from the usage of Blackmoor to refer to the Moors (north african berbers) this was first seen in 1547, black in reference to evil was first seen in 1583. While the previous blackmoor was purely adjectory, the noun usage was not seen until the 1620s. (eg. blacks). So technically your statement is incorrect, although I'm not sure the actual evolutionary path the words took at those times as only the written references of the times that document the usage in these contexts exist, not previous entries as to its spoken counterpart.

rf