Hello

As you can tell by my name, I am very anti Obama. I really do not like the other candidates either, but I just dislike them, I don’t loath them entirely.

John Hightower got it right when he said, "If God wanted us to vote, He would have given us candidates."

Watching the political "spectacle" is like watching Dumb and Dumber and Even Dumber. I don't want ANY of those people to get in there. I have a friend in Australia who said that the upside to the Presidential election is that George will be GONE! (She doesn't like him very much, none actually... in fact she despises him.)

Just curious. . . you posted this in April 2008.

What made you "loath" Obama already at that time?

at this point

just his view of abortion was enough


he advocated for killing live babies that were meant to be abortions


sick and twisted gross and disgusting

by this point he was also already talking about closing down coal plants and his wife was already going town to town talking about how we need to share our pie (while they shared nothing)

The race card was being thrown out and anyone who dared to disagree with him in any way was deemed racist.


I think the better question is, how the hell can you idolize him so much after the last three years? that is by far the bigger question. I get before he became president, if you were one to buy into all that hope and change. But once you saw what you actually got, how are you one of the very few without regret?

I think Obama has done a GREAT job in the last 3 years, if one consider the hate campaign he has been under all that time, and the situation that was left for him to begin fixing.

He has a HUGE list of accomplishments (I'll post it for you in the next couple of days if you want to), and really the only two things I have been disappointed about with him is that he compromised too much with the GOP, both on healthcare reform (because of that it was too water down) and on their black mail re: continuing the Bush tax cuts.

And you already know how I feel about abortion. . .so no need to repeat it.

I REALLY like Michelle Obama, and obviously I agree on the need for the very wealthy to share in the terrible economic situation we have been in because of Bush.. .

The {hate} against him is much more about his policy than him personally. I think most americans when asked said they liked him personally just not his policy. I can not seperate the two so I just hate him and his policy. Glad he has some genuine support. You are rare even if I don't like him I think its good if he has someone on his side.

I think you would be surprise how many people are still on his side!

But thanks. . . your comment reflects a sweet temperament.

His view of Abortion....also called, H Clinton view...who you like

Never thought of that, but that's true!

Actually, no. They are not the same. His view is more like Barbara Boxer who I hate more than any female alive. He advocates for killing the baby even after it is born if the woman was trying for abortion. Barbara Boxer advocates that it is not a baby even if it is alive and fully born till the mother picks it up and claims it.

And liking Hillary more than obama doesn't mean I actually like Hillary. I think she is a communist but I would rather Hillary the communist over obama the socialist in a primary.

In a general election, I am voting against both of them

do you have a reliable link to what you are asserting re: Obama wanting babies who are "alive" after "abortion" AND ARE VIABLE to be killed?

There are a number of them out there; there are also a few threads here at the HOP dedicated to the topic

It is not really a disputed topic that he voted for infanticide, its only disputed if it’s right or wrong.


http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news/nurse_says_obama_supports_infanticide/

http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/225404/why-obama-really-voted-infanticide/andrew-c-mccarthy

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jill_Stanek


Barbara boxer was far more open about her approval to kill live babies where obama just did the votes needed to make it ok and block votes that would stop it from staying legal and keep it from coming to the floor to be voted on. And seem uninterested when a nurse testified that live children were being put in dirty laundry rooms to die when they survived abortions.

No, dear. . .NOT "kill LIFE BABIES," but not use heroic measure to "save" later development FETUS who were not "liveable" without those heroic measures, and were too under developped or suffer from such disabilities that they would NEVER have survived past a few days.

Obviously, you provided "catholic" resources to begin with!

But, after going to your other source, all I can see is that Obama trusted in individual physicians' following their conscience and their oath to save a life IF they thought there was a life to save, without having to result to calling a second or a third opinion in the room.

I sure wish you and your "anti health care for all" supporters would be as consciencious about providing "heroic measures" for older children, and for adults, and for elderlies, who are in need of those immensly costly procedures. . .and do not get them because they cannot pay.

Now. . .who would have paid for the heroic measures applied to those late term fetus whose parents had already decided would not live?. . .The hospital? The doctor?

If you are not going to vote for them in a General, you should not vote for them in a primary...I could go vote for the worse Republican to the dems could win, but I let the republicans pick there own bad people. The only time I have ever caucused for the Dems, was those times I actuly planned to vote for the Dem ( 2 times since 1996) Even when I worked for the DLF ( dems in MN) I was very specific that I would only work on the Presidential issues for them, as I was not voting for dems at the State level...because I felt it would be unethical.

I cant vote for a republican when I am a democrat and if I regester as 3d party I cant vote at all.

Heroic measures do not include food and water, those are just normal decent things human beings should do for eachother. These are fully developed human beings who survived abortions and were put in a dirty laundry closet and left till dead.

I quickly googled the topic and posted the first three links. I dont know how good they were. You should already be fully aware of this topic since you are such a supporter. There is much more information to find if you are willing but I dont have time to dig up the interviews and the information for you on a topic you should have already been fully informed about

I would be more than happy to help pay for the life of a child. But you should realize the cost would be much lower if the abortionist would not have tried to kill the child on their way out of the womb

It is the "mother" who decides if there is value in her child and abortionist who kills her child and politicians who voted to let them decide on what baby lives or dies who does the deciding unfortunately.

What you call heroic actually sends chills up my spine.

Do you know what the term "heroic measures" means in medicine?
It means engaging in treatments that willcertainly cause even more damage or suffering, with little chance of cure or even prolonging death, basically a last chance attempt to prolong the life of someone who would certainly die in very short term if those heroic measures are not attempted.

Now, you are probably wondering why anyone would choose to not engage in those measures if a fetus is born breathing (outside of the cost which is usually huge). Well, here is one example that gives both a common reason why a woman would choose to have a late term abortion, and why letting a non liveable fetus die without engaging in heroic measures may in fact save more lifes:
sorry, I wanted to do a copy and paste, and I lost the text, so I will need to go copy it again.

Here is the article:
[QUOT3. ANENCEPHALIC BABIES (sample)

The literal meaning of anencephaly is "no brain." But the term is not exactly accurate for

an = negative*****enkephalos = brain

describing the condition of anencephalic babies. Such babies have no cerebrum or cerebellum but they do have a brain stem. The brain stem allows them to breathe and allows their hearts to beat. But the babies cannot see, hear, or feel anything. They will never be able to think or achieve what is called "personhood."

Anencephalic babies are thus not technically brain dead. Yet there is general consensus that heroic measures should not be used to keep them alive. In fact, anencephaly may be one of the few medical conditions that all doctors agree is futile to treat.

About 1000 anencephalic babies are born in the United States each year. The condition can be diagnosed prenatally, and most women (about 95%) who learn that they will have an anencephalic child choose to have an abortion. Of the 5% of the anencephalic infants who are born, about 55% are stillborn. The rest?the remaining 1000?are said to be "born dying."

Sometimes the parents of an anencephalic infant want to donate the infant's organs to other babies who need healthy organs. They say that, by donating the newborn's organs, they feel that the pregnancy would at least have had some value: their own loss can be another family's gain. In the United States, about 2000 babies each year need organs, and the only suitable organs for tiny babies are those from other tiny babies.

Organs cannot, however, be removed from individuals who are alive, and anencephalic babies, though born dying, are not dead. Thus, the debates have raged about whether it is appropriate to make an exception exclusively with anencephalic infants, changing the definition of "dead" in their case so that needed organs can be removed in time to be of use.

In 1992, for example, the parents of an anencephalic baby named Baby Theresa wanted to donate her organs. But the courts, all the way to the Florida Supreme Court, would not declare her dead. She lived for ten days. When she died, her organs could no longer be transplanted. On the day of her death, Baby Theresa's parents and a surgeon appeared on the Phil Donahue Show to talk about the need to change the law, so that organs from infants like Baby Theresa could be made available to others.E][/QUOTE]

[/QUOTE]



I am talking about full term babies who are born alive and generally healthy (except the damage an abortionist did while delivering them) and left to die in a dirty laundry room. Babies that are targeted to die for no other reason than their "moms" did not want them and did not care to adopt them out. Giving food, water and comfort are not heroic measures, its normal human treatment of each other.