WI Republicans strip out spending, pass bill reducing unions to wage bargaining only

[dogtowner]

Re: WI Republicans strip out spending, pass bill reducing unions to wage bargaining o

bla bla bla socialism...get a new line, its old and tired.

Americans voted the Dems in to the white house, house, senate...all talking about health care reform..Republicans offered nothing...and they got what they offered (actuly they got alot but they where given away from the start)

And Democrats where elected to office as well...To Protect Union Rights, and jobs and all that...They did what Dems wanted to do by making the Republicans actually have to stand up in front of the people and expalin there bill before they passed it...and polls showed over 60% backing the Dems....

Republicans Lied to the voters about what they would do, and lied about the intent of the bill, lied about the Budget, and refused to talk or negotiate...And used what may a Illegal vote to bypass actually having to compromise even a bit..

WI Voters did not vote for this, David Koch and his freinds did.

The GOP did offer health care reform. The donkeys were stuck on health insurance company reform. People said that health care cost too much so do something and the donkeys did not.

Yeah well the reality of the elections belie your tales of woe. This sort of union nonsense is strangling states everywhere. Deal with it. As Barry says, 'you lost'.

 

[pocketfullofshells]

Re: WI Republicans strip out spending, pass bill reducing unions to wage bargaining o

The GOP did offer health care reform. The donkeys were stuck on health insurance company reform. People said that health care cost too much so do something and the donkeys did not.

Yeah well the reality of the elections belie your tales of woe. This sort of union nonsense is strangling states everywhere. Deal with it. As Barry says, 'you lost'.

keep acting like it was about finances...and ignore that all the finances in the bill where taken out...it was a attack on Labor and the Democratic base. on Teachers, Cops, Firemen, Nurses, and those who help the public evry day...while they paid off rich backers with tax breaks..

Class war is all it was .

And Name one republican who said if you change the health care bill and add X I would vote for it...there was none...They had no bill...they had no plan, and they did not once offer to work on the Dems bill...When you the Minority you don't dictate the Bill and be nice and let the majority change it a bit...Thats how republicans acted...They had no intent to work on the bill to offer ideas for the bill that would make them possibly vote for it...unless the idea was...do what ever the Republicans want...

the Republican party is pathetic and worthless. I can't wait for the day the party is Dead.

 

[nobull]

Re: WI Republicans strip out spending, pass bill reducing unions to wage bargaining o

Yes it is bull. Bull that never needed to happen if the democratic congressmen had actually shown up to work. They brought it on themselves.

How about they all go back to work and put the exact same bill up for a vote today. Guess what? The results will be the same this time without the bull.

By the way, this bull, is less bullish than what went into passing obamacare. Did you complain about that?

DR Who...Your going to love this....

So How Does Redneck Texas Stack Up Against Progressive Unionized Wisconsin?
2009 4th Grade Math

White students: Texas 254, Wisconsin 250 (national average 248)
Black students: Texas 231, Wisconsin 217 (national 222)
Hispanic students: Texas 233, Wisconsin 228 (national 227)

2009 8th Grade Math

White students: Texas 301, Wisconsin 294 (national 294)
Black students: Texas 272, Wisconsin 254 (national 260)
Hispanic students: Texas 277, Wisconsin 268 (national 260)

2009 4th Grade Reading

White students: Texas 232, Wisconsin 227 (national 229)
Black students: Texas 213, Wisconsin 192 (national 204)
Hispanic students: Texas 210, Wisconsin 202 (national 204)

2009 8th Grade Reading

White students: Texas 273, Wisconsin 271 (national 271)
Black students: Texas 249, Wisconsin 238 (national 245)
Hispanic students: Texas 251, Wisconsin 250 (national 248)

2009 4th Grade Science

White students: Texas 168, Wisconsin 164 (national 162)
Black students: Texas 139, Wisconsin 121 (national 127)
Hispanic students: Wisconsin 138, Texas 136 (national 130)

2009 8th Grade Science

White students: Texas 167, Wisconsin 165 (national 161)
Black students: Texas 133, Wisconsin 120 (national 125)
Hispanic students: Texas 141, Wisconsin 134 (national 131)

To recap: white students in Texas perform better than white students in Wisconsin, black students in Texas perform better than black students in Wisconsin, Hispanic students in Texas perform better than Hispanic students in Wisconsin. In 18 separate ethnicity-controlled comparisons, the only one where Wisconsin students performed better than their peers in Texas was 4th grade science for Hispanic students (statistically insignificant), and this was reversed by 8th grade. Further, Texas students exceeded the national average for their ethnic cohort in all 18 comparisons; Wisconsinites were below the national average in 8, above average in 8.

What I think would be even more interesting would be an additional breakdown based upon poverty level and English language learners – and then statistics the makeup of the student body of Wisconsin to that of Texas. Once you looked at those figures, you would see clearly why Wisconsin might, at first glance look better in the aggregate statistics than Texas. After all, Wisconsin is whiter and more affluent than Texas, with significantly fewer students whose first language is not English, and so I suspect that would explain away some of Texas’ alleged deficiencies if one looks at raw, undifferentiated data. Oh, and by the way – it is interesting to note that Wisconsin’s unionized teachers make in the top half of salaries in the nation and have incredibly generous benefits while the non-union teachers of Texas are in the bottom third for average salary and have benefits that are nowhere near as generous as those given their Wisconsin counterparts. So it is clear that we Texas teacher do more with less than those in Wisconsin.

just sayin

doug

 

[Gipper]

Re: WI Republicans strip out spending, pass bill reducing unions to wage bargaining o

DR Who...Your going to love this....

So How Does Redneck Texas Stack Up Against Progressive Unionized Wisconsin?
2009 4th Grade Math

White students: Texas 254, Wisconsin 250 (national average 248)
Black students: Texas 231, Wisconsin 217 (national 222)
Hispanic students: Texas 233, Wisconsin 228 (national 227)

2009 8th Grade Math

White students: Texas 301, Wisconsin 294 (national 294)
Black students: Texas 272, Wisconsin 254 (national 260)
Hispanic students: Texas 277, Wisconsin 268 (national 260)

2009 4th Grade Reading

White students: Texas 232, Wisconsin 227 (national 229)
Black students: Texas 213, Wisconsin 192 (national 204)
Hispanic students: Texas 210, Wisconsin 202 (national 204)

2009 8th Grade Reading

White students: Texas 273, Wisconsin 271 (national 271)
Black students: Texas 249, Wisconsin 238 (national 245)
Hispanic students: Texas 251, Wisconsin 250 (national 248)

2009 4th Grade Science

White students: Texas 168, Wisconsin 164 (national 162)
Black students: Texas 139, Wisconsin 121 (national 127)
Hispanic students: Wisconsin 138, Texas 136 (national 130)

2009 8th Grade Science

White students: Texas 167, Wisconsin 165 (national 161)
Black students: Texas 133, Wisconsin 120 (national 125)
Hispanic students: Texas 141, Wisconsin 134 (national 131)

To recap: white students in Texas perform better than white students in Wisconsin, black students in Texas perform better than black students in Wisconsin, Hispanic students in Texas perform better than Hispanic students in Wisconsin. In 18 separate ethnicity-controlled comparisons, the only one where Wisconsin students performed better than their peers in Texas was 4th grade science for Hispanic students (statistically insignificant), and this was reversed by 8th grade. Further, Texas students exceeded the national average for their ethnic cohort in all 18 comparisons; Wisconsinites were below the national average in 8, above average in 8.

What I think would be even more interesting would be an additional breakdown based upon poverty level and English language learners – and then statistics the makeup of the student body of Wisconsin to that of Texas. Once you looked at those figures, you would see clearly why Wisconsin might, at first glance look better in the aggregate statistics than Texas. After all, Wisconsin is whiter and more affluent than Texas, with significantly fewer students whose first language is not English, and so I suspect that would explain away some of Texas’ alleged deficiencies if one looks at raw, undifferentiated data. Oh, and by the way – it is interesting to note that Wisconsin’s unionized teachers make in the top half of salaries in the nation and have incredibly generous benefits while the non-union teachers of Texas are in the bottom third for average salary and have benefits that are nowhere near as generous as those given their Wisconsin counterparts. So it is clear that we Texas teacher do more with less than those in Wisconsin.

just sayin

doug

I wonder if Texas also spends less per student than the Cheeseheads. It would seem likely that they do.

Could you supply a link to the information you posted?

 

[Dr.Who]

Re: WI Republicans strip out spending, pass bill reducing unions to wage bargaining o

Ummm I am not the only one saying this may have been done illegally, and those who have said it, know more about it then you or me and very likely the clerk as well.
Also I don't know what part of the Republicans did not offer any debate on this issue...Had they not fled the state it would have passed with no say whatsoever from the dems, thats why they left...

And the "state cant afford it" stuff is pure bull...they just haded out tax breaks..that where not paid for...but I guess that could be afforded? And all of the financial parts of this bill...where agreed on already by the unions and Dems....Those where all stripped from the bill.

Leaving the state was also pure bull.

 

[Dr.Who]

Re: WI Republicans strip out spending, pass bill reducing unions to wage bargaining o

yes maybe in your dream world it was the same...the Dems owned all 3 branches...and Debated health care for months and months. The fact that republicans idea of compromise is...pass there health care plan or nothing....is not my fault. The dems showed very willing to negotiate on this...But republicans said no to debate, no to any time at all to look at it, and no to any compromise.

Why was there no time? simple the people vastly supported the Dems Side.
Also they did not have to lie and make up **** like death panals to scare support up.

That view is simply a distortion of events. The dems in wisc had more opportunity for input than the pubs in the fed.

 

[steveox]

Re: WI Republicans strip out spending, pass bill reducing unions to wage bargaining o

Wait a minute!! Did Nancy Pelosi, Harry Reid and Obama did the samething with the Health care bill? It was illegal! Obama bribed democrats with deals to get them vote for healthcare. Just like he threaten to close the Air Force Base in Nebraska if the Nebraska sentaor didnt vote for that health care. So if the democrats can get away with that **** why cant the wisconsin republicans? ITS FAIR GAME!!!

 

[Rick]

Re: WI Republicans strip out spending, pass bill reducing unions to wage bargaining o

yes maybe in your dream world it was the same...the Dems owned all 3 branches...and Debated health care for months and months. The fact that republicans idea of compromise is...pass there health care plan or nothing....is not my fault. The dems showed very willing to negotiate on this...But republicans said no to debate, no to any time at all to look at it, and no to any compromise.

Why was there no time? simple the people vastly supported the Dems Side.
Also they did not have to lie and make up **** like death panals to scare support up.

This is yet ANOTHER of pockets bald-faced lies, about all he has left. The republicans offered MANY amendments to obozo's rationing/death panel scheme, which were automatically voted down in committee over and over in a monotonous party line vote by the leftwingers. The only real debate which was allowed was that in secret closed-door meetings, between the "normal" obozo leftwingers, and the crazy foaming-at-the-mouth ultra extreme leftwingers.

 

[BigRob]

Re: WI Republicans strip out spending, pass bill reducing unions to wage bargaining o

Ummm I am not the only one saying this may have been done illegally, and those who have said it, know more about it then you or me and very likely the clerk as well.

The clerk is responsible for committee procedures..Are you saying the clerk that oversaw that is incompetent?

Also I don't know what part of the Republicans did not offer any debate on this issue...Had they not fled the state it would have passed with no say whatsoever from the dems, thats why they left...

So if Republicans from 2006-2008 had just fled Washington and refused to vote on anything, you would have thought it was a good tactic?

And the "state cant afford it" stuff is pure bull...they just haded out tax breaks..that where not paid for...but I guess that could be afforded? And all of the financial parts of this bill...where agreed on already by the unions and Dems....Those where all stripped from the bill.

Unions are still allowed to collectively bargain for wages, and it just brought their benefits more in line with the private sector. Additionally, all it did was put them in line (better off actually) with how federal government employees are treated.

What is wrong with that? Without it, their were going to be layoffs...is that the better option?

 

[Dr.Who]

Re: WI Republicans strip out spending, pass bill reducing unions to wage bargaining o

And the "state cant afford it" stuff is pure bull...they just haded out tax breaks..that where not paid for...but I guess that could be afforded? And all of the financial parts of this bill...where agreed on already by the unions and Dems....Those where all stripped from the bill.

Lets not forget that the tax breaks that were allegedly not paid for are nothing of the sort.

If the state had decided not to tax people/companies who had been taxed before they would be "giving up" money that they previously had. If we assume that it was their money and not ours then we could also say that it was an expense that needed to be pad for. Of course a tax break is not an expense it is a reduction of an income. And in this case the only people who got the break were people who were not previously in the state and were not previously paying income to the state. No income was reduced, in fact the opposite will be true - in three years those who moved to the state to get the tax break will start paying taxes and the states income will go up.