Raise Taxes or Granny Gets It

[ProudLefty]

...

BO is probably the most politically ideological man ever to be president.

OK! I'd love to have this discussion! My view is very different than yours, and I would enjoy learning why we see the same thing and get very different answers.

You see Obama as ideological, and I see him as pragmatic and with a very wide range of what is acceptable to him. I mean, he did just agree to put SS, Medicare, and Medicaid on the table for talks, right?

I see him as a a community organizer, suddenly with a really big community. He seems to me to be more interested in the whole "getting the community organized" idea than he is on any ideological purity. He accepted Don't Ask, Don't tell", he accepted DOMA, he accepted ramping up in Afghanistan, involvement in Libya, and a really Alpha attack on Pakistan to get OBL.

I see Obama as being more interested in making the deal than in the outcome of the deal. Yes, he has limits, but those limits are not narrow limits, and they do not appear to me to be ideological limits but rather the limits he perceives from the voters.

I would be really interested in your views as to his ideologies.

 

[Mr. Shaman]

The Rs are doing all sorts of things, but your assertion that BO is clean as the driven snow is not correct. He is playing politics just like the Rs.

Not necessarily.

You can't be including the LAZY/CRAZY Rs!!!!!!
​

"I tell people, that “personal property” and the ownership of that personal property is crucial to our way of life.

Our founding fathers understood that it was a very important part of the pursuit of happiness. Being able to own things that are your own is one of the things that makes America unique. But I happen to think that it’s in jeopardy.

It’s in jeopardy because of taxes; it’s in jeopardy because of regulation; it’s in jeopardy because of a legal system that’s run amok. And I think it’s time for us to just hand it over to God and say, “God, You’re going to have to fix this.”

I think it’s time for us to use our wisdom and our influence and really put it in God’s hands. That’s what I’m going to do, and I hope you’ll join me."

"Perry?? AGAIN?!! Take A Message."​

Wait'll God tells Perry..."I've GIVEN you all the Mexicans I've GOT!!!"

 

[pocketfullofshells]

Clearly, Obama is playing politics with a volatile issue, just as the "conservatives" are doing when they rant about ending "entitlements", which are mainly social security and medicare.

Nobody, but nobody is addressing the issue of deficit spending in a realistic way.

what because he has pushed for a bigger deal , and said evrything is on the table, and reports show he is talking cuts to some of the big 3?

Sure if politics is giving more to the other side and pissing off your base in order to do whats best for the nation..then yea he is playing...

 

[PLC1]

What is it that Obama has done that makes you say he is playing politics?

It looks to me like he has played this with seriousness and has reached for agreement and compromise at every step. How many times have Republicans made demands, had their demands accepted, and then changed their demands? Republicans are refusing to take yes for an answer.

Scaring seniors about their Social Security is playing politics. He knows darned well that SS isn't going to be shut down. Why not pick out something less emotional to say we may not be able to do for a while?

 

[PLC1]

what because he has pushed for a bigger deal , and said evrything is on the table, and reports show he is talking cuts to some of the big 3?

Sure if politics is giving more to the other side and pissing off your base in order to do whats best for the nation..then yea he is playing...

Of course he's playing politics. He didn't get elected to the WH without being very good at playing politics. That's what politicians do, after all.

 

[ProudLefty]

what because he has pushed for a bigger deal , and said evrything is on the table, and reports show he is talking cuts to some of the big 3?

Sure if politics is giving more to the other side and pissing off your base in order to do whats best for the nation..then yea he is playing...

Republicans have refused to take yes for an answer. Its pretty clear they want a shutdown.

Of course, their moneyed backers on Wall Street don't want a shutdown, so now the Republicans have got their tits in the wringer and Obama is more than willing to turn that crank.

 

[pocketfullofshells]

Republicans have refused to take yes for an answer. Its pretty clear they want a shutdown.

Of course, their moneyed backers on Wall Street don't want a shutdown, so now the Republicans have got their tits in the wringer and Obama is more than willing to turn that crank.

if only it was a shutdown...shutdowns are annoying and costly but you can deal with them for a few weeks while they figure it out...Defaulting...thats Huge and you don't just say ok its back going again we agreed...its like not paying your credit cards for a few months and then getting money to pay again...does not matter if you can pay again...damage is done and lasts years.

 

[Dr.Who]

OK. So whats your plan? How do you believe those checks should be covered if there is no money in the till? Who do you suggest go unpaid?

My choice would be legislators and their staffs. That would probably resolve the whole issue is about 9 minutes, but they already took care and ensured their own pay gets paid first, before all else.

Just to be clear, not paying our debts is unconstitutional, so interest and debt to foreigners gets paid, period. That is not a choice.

There is enough money coming in to pay the debt, social security, and the soldiers. so how do the checks get covered? The gov merely has to pay them with the money that is coming in. All the politicians know this and when some of them say that granny gets it they are flat out lying.

http://www.americanthinker.com/2011/07/debt_ceiling_worst_case_scenario.html

There are plenty of other things that can be cut.

 

[steveox]

This is why Democrats are gonna lose the election in both houses. It seems Seniors,Women,African Americans and Latinoes support democrats because of welfare,food stamps and SSI.Obama already said hes cutting off SSI,Welfare,WIC program and Food stamps. Now its not just the Republicans holding things up Democrats wont compromise. So whos gonna get hurt more in the Ballot box? Hint its not the G.O.P though.

 

[ProudLefty]

There is enough money coming in to pay the debt, social security, and the soldiers. so how do the checks get covered? The gov merely has to pay them with the money that is coming in. All the politicians know this and when some of them say that granny gets it they are flat out lying.

http://www.americanthinker.com/2011/07/debt_ceiling_worst_case_scenario.html

There are plenty of other things that can be cut.

Really. Who gets to decide? Can Obama just say "Social Security checks to everyone who lives in a Democratic District, and we'll let the TEA Partiers worry about their own districts"? Can Obama just say "OK, we won't be paying legislators or their staffs"? Can Obama say "We will pay in alphabetical order" or "We will pay Pell Grants but not flood relief"

Sadly, Republicans are being fed a pack of lies from some of their fruitcake leaders, and that is who they are listening to instead of listening to their responsible leaders. They are listening to Michelle Bachman and not to Lindsay Graham and other moderate Republicans.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/special/politics/federal-debt-limit-you-choose-who-gets-paid/

 

[PLC1]

This is why Democrats are gonna lose the election in both houses. It seems Seniors,Women,African Americans and Latinoes support democrats because of welfare,food stamps and SSI.Obama already said hes cutting off SSI,Welfare,WIC program and Food stamps. Now its not just the Republicans holding things up Democrats wont compromise. So whos gonna get hurt more in the Ballot box? Hint its not the G.O.P though.

Will it be up to the GOP to keep the welfare state going, then?

 

[ThisTooShallPass]

Republicans have refused to take yes for an answer. Its pretty clear they want a shutdown.

Of course, their moneyed backers on Wall Street don't want a shutdown, so now the Republicans have got their tits in the wringer and Obama is more than willing to turn that crank.

There will not be a "shutdown." We're talking about government's operations being forcefully suspended because of the absence of a budget resolution. We're simply talking about an inability to finance operations with debt.

Why wouldn't Republicans want this? They want a balanced budget, and hitting the debt limit will give them one immediately.

 

[PLC1]

There will not be a "shutdown." We're talking about government's operations being forcefully suspended because of the absence of a budget resolution. We're simply talking about an inability to finance operations with debt.

Why wouldn't Republicans want this? They want a balanced budget, and hitting the debt limit will give them one immediately.

Do you actually believe Republicans when they say they want a balanced budget?

If they do, why didn't they pass one when they were in power?

 

[ThisTooShallPass]

Do you actually believe Republicans when they say they want a balanced budget?

If they do, why didn't they pass one when they were in power?

For the obvious reason that they didn't want to accept responsibility for the economic damage that would result.

Or rather for the revelation of the economic damage that had already occurred and which was no longer being covered up with deficit spending.

 

[PLC1]

For the obvious reason that they didn't want to accept responsibility for the economic damage that would result.

Or rather for the revelation of the economic damage that had already occurred and which was no longer being covered up with deficit spending.

Yep, that sounds about right.