Oregon passes tax increases on corporations and the wealthy..

[PLC1]

Here's a question for people arguing that black people in general are worse off than whites due to racism:

A couple of generations ago, back in the early '40s, Japanese Americans were rounded up and placed in concentration camps for the duration of the war against Japan. Many of them lost homes and businesses due to the "relocation". They came home to be greeted with "No Japs allowed" sorts of signs.

Yet, today, the Japanese Americans are no worse off than their white counterparts.

In fact, we hear very little about being Japanese, or about being Asian in America.

Why do you think that is?

 

[rationalist]

Because there are not lots of very poor Japanese people in the US.

 

[Pandora]

Here's a question for people arguing that black people in general are worse off than whites due to racism:

A couple of generations ago, back in the early '40s, Japanese Americans were rounded up and placed in concentration camps for the duration of the war against Japan. Many of them lost homes and businesses due to the "relocation". They came home to be greeted with "No Japs allowed" sorts of signs.

Yet, today, the Japanese Americans are no worse off than their white counterparts.

In fact, we hear very little about being Japanese, or about being Asian in America.

Why do you think that is?

I think it goes for Asians in general. Asian people assimilate in the community and the culture has strong values on school so Asian people in general are more educated even when coming from a poor family. I also think they do not hold grudges. Chinese people were basicly slave labor in the 1800's building railroads and washing laundry. Cambodian and Vietnamese were treated terrible and called horrible names after Vietnam but I never hear them dwell on it. korean people also after the korean war.

Native Americans and African Americans on the other hand often still complain about things that for the most part happened to their parents and grandparents and older. These two groups still demand some sort of pay back for things done to their past generations. There is not enough money in the world to pay either group back for the crimes done to their ancestors but they still want and expect it. Asian Americans on the other hand moved on and are better off for it.

 

[PLC1]

I think it goes for Asians in general. Asian people assimilate in the community and the culture has strong values on school so Asian people in general are more educated even when coming from a poor family. I also think they do not hold grudges. Chinese people were basicly slave labor in the 1800's building railroads and washing laundry. Cambodian and Vietnamese were treated terrible and called horrible names after Vietnam but I never hear them dwell on it. korean people also after the korean war.

Native Americans and African Americans on the other hand often still complain about things that for the most part happened to their parents and grandparents and older. These two groups still demand some sort of pay back for things done to their past generations. There is not enough money in the world to pay either group back for the crimes done to their ancestors but they still want and expect it. Asian Americans on the other hand moved on and are better off for it.

Would you say, then, that the differences are cultural rather than racial?

If so, is there anything that the government can do to change a person's cultural outlook?

 

[Pandora]

Would you say, then, that the differences are cultural rather than racial?

If so, is there anything that the government can do to change a person's cultural outlook?

Yes its more cultural than racial IMO

I dont think the government is good at just about anything so.... No!

People in the Black and Native community who have overcame can do the most by talking to the community they came from and explaining how they over came. But it wont be welcomed I dont think.

Look at Bill Cosby, he tried to talk to blacks about the problems and he got attacked for it by other blacks who intentionally want to keep blacks down like Jesse Jackson. Nothing Cosby said was wrong and to follow his advice would only make stronger black families but people like Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton were offended by it.

I think the same kind of thing goes on in the Native world. There are some higher ups who make their living off of the poor in their communities so there is a financial gain for keeping people down. In Asian communities they do what ever they can to build their people up, not tear them down. But then again there is no $$ gain to keeping people down in Asian communities.

 

[citizenzen]

I dont think the government is good at just about anything so....

Since we have a government of the people, aren't you really saying, "I don't think people are good at just about anything"?

It's such a negative attitude.

 

[Pandora]

Since we have a government of the people, aren't you really saying, "I don't think people are good at just about anything"?

It's such a negative attitude.

I agree it is a negative attitude, but its an honest statement. What do you think government does well?

Perhaps you can help me find some good?

 

[citizenzen]

I agree it is a negative attitude, but its an honest statement. What do you think government does well?

Perhaps you can help me find some good?

I think the government performs a great deal of functions... too numerous to state. A couple that personally come to mind...

• Education - I am a product of a public education, as are most Americans. The government has, over our history, provided this incredible service to all citizens, and our country has benefitted enormously because of it.

• Standards - The standards for clean water, clean air, uncontaminated food and drugs have allowed us to live relatively carefree and safe from the life threatening conditions that are commonplace in some places in the world.

• Renewal - For over 200 years, every office, whether local, state of federal has seen a constant influx of new people and new ideas. Anybody truly can serve and make a difference if they want to.

• Progress - Our government has proven over those 200 years that it can facilitate and nurture technical, commercial and social progress. We didn't become the leader of the free will despite the government. We became the leader of the free world working hand-in-hand with it.

Those are just a few. Give me a little time, and I'm sure I'll think of many more!

 

[PLC1]

Yes its more cultural than racial IMO

I dont think the government is good at just about anything so.... No!

People in the Black and Native community who have overcame can do the most by talking to the community they came from and explaining how they over came. But it wont be welcomed I dont think.

Look at Bill Cosby, he tried to talk to blacks about the problems and he got attacked for it by other blacks who intentionally want to keep blacks down like Jesse Jackson. Nothing Cosby said was wrong and to follow his advice would only make stronger black families but people like Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton were offended by it.

I think the same kind of thing goes on in the Native world. There are some higher ups who make their living off of the poor in their communities so there is a financial gain for keeping people down. In Asian communities they do what ever they can to build their people up, not tear them down. But then again there is no $$ gain to keeping people down in Asian communities.

Right on, Pandora.

There are some things that government can do, and probably only government can do, like defending the country and building highways for example. The government can do some things right, I'd have to disagree with that one. Changing people's attitudes about the things we've been discussing isn't one of them. Government welfare just makes the problems worse.

 

[dogtowner]

Because there are not lots of very poor Japanese people in the US.

most came here that way though. same with most asians.

 

[rationalist]

They didn't come as slaves

 

[PLC1]

They didn't come as slaves

Neither did anyone currently living in the US.

But some people still remember the "relocation" camps.

 

[dogtowner]

They didn't come as slaves

And there have not been slaves at all for 140+ years.

 

[Pandora]

I think the government performs a great deal of functions... too numerous to state. A couple that personally come to mind...

You are correct that the government performs a great deal of functions... too numerous to state. But what I asked is ..... What do you think government does well?

• Education - I am a product of a public education, as are most Americans. The government has, over our history, provided this incredible service to all citizens, and our country has benefitted enormously because of it.

We spend more money than almost all countries if not all countries and we are lacking behind many others in education, and it seems to be getting worse not better. I could go on and on with examples if you want me to. Private schools function better than public, produce better results at education. The government does not maintain schools better than the private sector and not for less money.

• Standards - The standards for clean water, clean air, uncontaminated food and drugs have allowed us to live relatively carefree and safe from the life threatening conditions that are commonplace in some places in the world.

I think you are right here but at what cost? A bloated budget. If this were done through the private sector with government standards it would be done just as well for less money.

• Renewal - For over 200 years, every office, whether local, state of federal has seen a constant influx of new people and new ideas. Anybody truly can serve and make a difference if they want to.

Agreed again but I think the differences made have been for the worst, and really what do they care? There is no bottom line, no bottom dollar. Throw 2 billion at some dumb project and if it doesn’t work out so what. Its not like anyone’s head is going to roll

• Progress - Our government has proven over those 200 years that it can facilitate and nurture technical, commercial and social progress. We didn't become the leader of the free will despite the government. We became the leader of the free world working hand-in-hand with it.

We are fast gaining a new title to replace leader of the free world. Every program you named can be done and done better and for less by private groups.

Those are just a few. Give me a little time, and I'm sure I'll think of many more!

Yes please think of more But what I want to know is what Government does better than the private sector. Not just what the government does... as you said they do many things. I am just not impressed by them.

 

[Pandora]

Right on, Pandora.

There are some things that government can do, and probably only government can do, like defending the country and building highways for example.

I will agree with you that only government can run the military, mostly because I am not sure what the global rules are on a private military killing or fighting wars in the name of a country. I support my military but I do think they should be more fiscally prudent. Like all other government entities, there is no bottom line, no bottom dollar. If you waste a ton, oh well it didn’t come out of your pocket. I am sure our military is just as wasteful with money as other government sectors. They should have to manage what they get better.

Highways ? Well I don’t know as much about that as I do basic roads, they may do that better also, but why cant it be contracted out to the private sector?

The government can do some things right, I'd have to disagree with that one. Changing people's attitudes about the things we've been discussing isn't one of them. Government welfare just makes the problems worse.

I would agree the government does the military better than a private sector group could. But I do not think most of the people leaning left would agree. I was hoping for something everyone could agree on that the government does well.

It might end up being highways that everyone agrees on