Is This Who We Really Are?

[Greco]

You make all these grand assumptions, and state them as if they're facts.

We'll just take a few of 'em to showcase your buffoonery.

"The senator is right as far as the constition goes: there is no authority for the fed to offer help."

The Consitution also doesn't grant authority to operate the FAA, NASA, or build federal highways. That's not an acid test, unless you want to return us to the 1700's. However, the Constitution doesn't say that federal laws should grant favor to insurance companies, but that's what's happened.

"But if this woman did not have the money then obvioiusly the insurer that denied her was medicaid - a gov program."

Your "obvious" assertion illustrates you lack of knowledge about Medicaid. It's administered differently, state by state. In Oklahoma only the poverty line and below can quality. If you're earning a massive $25,000 annual household income, you're too wealthy.

"Again is anyone stupid enough to think that the nursing home was going to discharge him with a feeding tube still in his throat."

Are you so stupid you don't even bother to check facts before making your claims? Here in Oklahoma, the nursing home lobby has bought and paid for our wingnut legislators over and over. Almost weekly there are nursing home abuses reported in the news. Issues like selling someone's medicine, rape, thefts of assets, etc. Very few ever result in criminal proceedings because our legislators have protected them with bills. So yes, it's well within the realm of possibility that the scenario, just as it was described, happened in Oklahoma. No one from here doubts it, even the wingnuts.

 

[Mare Tranquillity]

Clearly you can all see that there is something fishy about the way this story is told.

Are any of you really stupid enough to believe that a nursing home can kick a man out onto the streets and the laws would not already cover that situation?! There is something that is not being told here.

Hospitals put people into taxis and pay for them to be taken downtown and turned out, facilities do have the right to turn out people who can no longer pay. This is capitalism, ain't it great?

 

[pocketfullofshells]

Obviously the Senator's point was that expanding the government is not the solution that can best help this woman and her husband.

In fact, the Senator has proposed S. 1099 (which has been ignored by the Democratic Senate) which would reform health care and insurance in the private market. This solution would bring the most help to this woman and her husband.

and what reform would give her coverage? what in his bill would do anything?

also I like his, where are our neighbors....Ummm yea just have a Fing bake sale in the neigbor hood and pay for it...bright man he is. you know who our neighbors are? maybe thats how our Deffence budget should be set as well, no national Deffence, just have your neigbors back...pool your money and buy a tank for your own block and some AA, and guns...its a rational idea right?

so many cases like hers, and the rights plan seems to be give the insurance compaies what they want and pretend like they will fix it..because we all know whats best for us is what they want, its not like they want Record Profits .....

anyone notices how she did not have to call him Unamerican, question his patriotism, or call him Hitler? odd

I realy hope she finds the help she needs....But I can tell you who is not going to help I bed...the Insurance industry.

 

[PLC1]

call me names and suggest ridiculously obtuse "interpretations" (read: lies) about what others have said here (neighbors doing brain surgery, etc.).

Well, I didn't call anyone any names, and the suggestion, quoted in the OP from the senator, to wit:

He told her that her neighbors should be the ones helping. That brought a reaction from the crowd, a round of applause.

Does make it appear that the crowd liked the idea of the neighbors helping in that situation.

Neighbors doing brain surgery may be a slight exaggeration (humor is based on exaggeration, you know) but it isn't too far from what was being applauded, now is it?

Oh, yes, humor also depends on being grounded, at least partly, in reality.

What, exactly, did you visualize the neighbors doing to help this couple?

Having a car wash?

 

[GenSeneca]

I realy hope she finds the help she needs....But I can tell you who is not going to help I bed...the Insurance industry.

She certainly can't expect any help from you!

... Or any of the other hypocritical whiners that spend their time crying about how helping these people is a moral imperative but you're to much of a cheapskate to fork your own money out of your own wallets to help those who need assistance...

Nah, you'll just piss and moan that Conservatives are standing in your way of having Big Government pick-pocket taxpayers to fund a waste and fraud-filled-feel-good program that will make you even more smug and pretentious than you are now.

 

[Pandora]

She certainly can't expect any help from you!

... Or any of the other hypocritical whiners that spend their time crying about how helping these people is a moral imperative but you're to much of a cheapskate to fork your own money out of your own wallets to help those who need assistance...

Nah, you'll just piss and moan that Conservatives are standing in your way of having Big Government pick-pocket taxpayers to fund a waste and fraud-filled-feel-good program that will make you even more smug and pretentious than you are now.

But conservatives and republicans ARE NOT standing in the way. The dems have bragged that they have all the votes they need in the house and senate. If they think they can survive politically then pass the damn crap.


They cant because democrats wont vote for it, because they know they will be tossed out of office on their sorry bottoms right after they do.

so its untrue when they say conservatives or republicans are getting in the way.

 

[pocketfullofshells]

She certainly can't expect any help from you!

... Or any of the other hypocritical whiners that spend their time crying about how helping these people is a moral imperative but you're to much of a cheapskate to fork your own money out of your own wallets to help those who need assistance...

Nah, you'll just piss and moan that Conservatives are standing in your way of having Big Government pick-pocket taxpayers to fund a waste and fraud-filled-feel-good program that will make you even more smug and pretentious than you are now.

First do you know if I give money to groups to help with health care? no you dont.

2nd I cant send enough cash to do anything, thats the point of supporting a system that pools it to help those who need it. you can call it socialism but that is fact what Insurance is.

 

[Little-Acorn]

Neighbors doing brain surgery may be a slight exaggeration

Or it may be a ridiculously obtuse twist of what was said. In fact, it was exactly that.

(Rest of PLC1's careful pretensions and continually feigned ignorance deleted)

And still no refutation of the point that government takeover is far from the best way to help.

 

[GenSeneca]

First do you know if I give money to groups to help with health care? no you dont.

I'm certain of it... You even said as much in your next sentence:

2nd I cant send enough cash to do anything, thats the point of supporting a system that pools it to help those who need it.

Its called CHARITY when its voluntary and SOCIALISM when its compulsory.

You think that your donation wouldn't help when sent in VOLUNTARILY but you think the exact same amount of your money taken by FORCE through taxation would make a difference?

If its a "moral imperative" to take care of these people, then you are acting immorally for refusing to help them out without being forced to do so by the government.

Same goes for all the Statist goons that are trying to claim the moral high ground on this issue. You hypocrites refuse to abide by your own concept of morality when its voluntary, you have to be forced by government to act "morally" but piss and moan when its the Christian morality being forced upon you.

 

[Bunz]

As tragic as the woman's story was, the real appalling part, that reflects on all of us, was the enthusiastic round of supporting applause from the crowd as Senator Coburn informed her she didn't merit help. What have we become?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e3jwhLcW_c8

Frankly I dont know what to say. I could only imagine what must have been going through that womans head in those moments. Someone who is in the most difficult of positions, on top of dealing with the condition of her husband, she faces financial ruin of everything they worked for just to keep him alive in the most basic of ways.
Either way, this is a problem that is going on all over the country. The current problem is that insurance simply costs to much for most people. Premiums for a family is steep. Then throw on the deductibles, co-pays and that only covers a certain percentage!

I also get a major chuckle from those who seem to like the status quo. Because thier gripes and at times collective meltdowns, are over things that already exist and are prevelant practices among the insurance companies.

Medical Insurance, where the only thing that stands between you and your doctor is thier bottom line.

The insurance racket is among the most crooked industries out there.

 

[Bunz]

Not all of us.

Some of us are people who would react to this by forcibly taking money from those same neighbors at gunpoint (called "taxes"), and then take increasing amounts from them, regardless of how much the neighbors might need or deserve it themselves, and try to set up vas tprograms to "help" her instead.

Holding onto this most basic of views is gonna cause your blood pressure to go up. Be careful because high blood pressure is a pre-existing condition. The free market might decide you are to expensive.

 

[Bunz]

Obviously the Senator's point was that expanding the government is not the solution that can best help this woman and her husband.

In fact, the Senator has proposed S. 1099 (which has been ignored by the Democratic Senate) which would reform health care and insurance in the private market. This solution would bring the most help to this woman and her husband.

At what cost? That is the biggest problem right now. My father has private health insurance. He went in to get some day surgery just last week. With his health insurance, and deductible it is still going to cost him 4,000 bucks!

 

[GenSeneca]

I also get a major chuckle from those who seem to like the status quo.

Please point one out... I've yet to see even one.

 

[Bunz]

How much of your time and money have you contributed to helping this woman and her husband?

Well I am willing to give her roughly %30 of my 60+ hours a week.

 

[GenSeneca]

Medical Insurance, where the only thing that stands between you and your doctor is thier bottom line.

Their "massive profits" account for a whopping 0.6% of what we spend on healthcare and the CEO's pay is a staggering 0.05% of the total HC spending.

The Public Option, where the only thing that stands between you and your doctor is an unelected, unaccountable Washington bureaucrat...

Who wouldn't prefer that?