BP oil execs get bonus for "safety"

[BigRob]

They have redeemed themselves:

Transocean executives donating safety bonuses to oil spill victims

Kudos to them for doing the right thing.

Yes..kudos to these executives for caving into ridiculous political shrilling.

 

[Dr.Who]

They have redeemed themselves:

Transocean executives donating safety bonuses to oil spill victims

Kudos to them for doing the right thing.

If they were not responsible in the first place then there was no need for redemption.

They just did what was right anyway. Perhaps due to pressure as Big Rob said. But not due to government regulation.

We will have to remember that you said they did the right thing the next time a progressive is complaining that corporations are evil.

 

[TruthSeeker]

They have redeemed themselves:

Transocean executives donating safety bonuses to oil spill victims

Kudos to them for doing the right thing.

Big deal. They should not have gotten bonuses in the first place.

Corporations like these give the "good" corporations a bad name.

This plays into that whole "all or nothing" leftist creed. If one corporation is corrupt, then all corporations must be corrupt. Childish.

 

[pocketfullofshells]

I do agree that government spending can create a stimulus effect...but by the same token, it also removes that same effect from the private sector.

If the CEO were taxed more, the money would ultimately be cycled through, but the issue at hand is do we want private sector to be the driving force of economic growth or do we want to rely on the government to make those decisions for us.

I prefer the private sector.

does not really matter what you prefer....what matters is what can and will.
I would love to see the private sector spending lots and making the econ go...but they are hoarding it and making the wallets of the richest fatter....but not doing anything else...If the Private sector does not spend, and the consumer does not spend, that leaves only the government left....

we can the private sector to do all we want, it does not make it happen.

 

[pocketfullofshells]

Big deal. They should not have gotten bonuses in the first place.

Corporations like these give the "good" corporations a bad name.

This plays into that whole "all or nothing" leftist creed. If one corporation is corrupt, then all corporations must be corrupt. Childish.

Don't worry they will write it all off as donation to charity anyway...who knows maybe they can end up like GE and pay no taxes at all!

and not all corperations are evil...thats more or less a straw man argument. ( I say almost becuse yes there are some crazy nut job hippies that would say it...but its not even close to a majority)
But the fact is that our corporate culture today...has alot of greed and corruption in it. PO boxes offshore listed as corperate HQ to tax evasion? Just because they have greased enough pockets do make it "legal" does not make it less corrupt.
I mean look at the banks, the crap they where selling and knew was bad, but so long as it made a buck who cares ( and then when bailed out pay us huge bonus's for Fing up ). Our local news here has been watching one of the best known car dealerships here go down as they found...about 10 pages worth of illegal activity going on. Oddly the owner and a few otehrs are actuly going to jail. and you have Enron, Worldcom, Tyco, exxon I think still fighting and not paying its bill for Valdez...BP just flat out lying to us during the oil spill..just about daily. Company I use to work for made a whole bunch of moves, made quick bumps in profits, then ran off with the money as the company went down hill do the changes. ( short term gains, at expense of long term and then flee)

part of the problem is simple greed, but also part is we have a system in place where there is almost no check against the top of big companies doing what ever they want, and paying themself what ever they want. Part of that check...use to be Unions...and Boards are suppose to, but they are worthless as half the time they are just simply stacked with those who will do what they want...and in return there board someplace else does the same...

To often the Right simply tries to just pretend it does not exist, or its always just a few bad apples...Its alot easier to just scream communist at anyone who sees a unfair playing field loaded with cheats.

 

[BigRob]

does not really matter what you prefer....what matters is what can and will.
I would love to see the private sector spending lots and making the econ go...but they are hoarding it and making the wallets of the richest fatter....but not doing anything else...If the Private sector does not spend, and the consumer does not spend, that leaves only the government left....

we can the private sector to do all we want, it does not make it happen.

This is absurd....what exactly do you think banks do with deposits? If they don't invest it or move the money through, they are not going to be able to make any money.

 

[dahermit]

This is absurd....what exactly do you think banks do with deposits? If they don't invest it or move the money through, they are not going to be able to make any money.

The rich do not put money in banks. Putting money in banks is the act of the financially naive; the interest rate is too small, inflation eats up the interest. The rich are not financially naive. The many poor however, deposit their meager savings in banks, not knowing any better.

They use their money in ways that yield better returns like day trading or "parasiting" (buy large amounts, sell when there is a slight increase in the price), a stock. It is notable however, that such a practice does little to nothing for the economy.

 

[Dr.Who]

Big deal. They should not have gotten bonuses in the first place.

Corporations like these give the "good" corporations a bad name.

This plays into that whole "all or nothing" leftist creed. If one corporation is corrupt, then all corporations must be corrupt. Childish.

Please tell us why the director of refining does not deserve his bonus? Didn't he increase the efficiency of the refining process so that a billion gallons of crude oil could produce twenty percent more gas?

I have no idea, but neither do you, right?

Oh, wait, were you being sarcastic? If you were then so was I

 

[Dr.Who]

Don't worry they will write it all off as donation to charity anyway...who knows maybe they can end up like GE and pay no taxes at all!

and not all corperations are evil...thats more or less a straw man argument. ( I say almost becuse yes there are some crazy nut job hippies that would say it...but its not even close to a majority)
But the fact is that our corporate culture today...has alot of greed and corruption in it. PO boxes offshore listed as corperate HQ to tax evasion? Just because they have greased enough pockets do make it "legal" does not make it less corrupt.
I mean look at the banks, the crap they where selling and knew was bad, but so long as it made a buck who cares ( and then when bailed out pay us huge bonus's for Fing up ). Our local news here has been watching one of the best known car dealerships here go down as they found...about 10 pages worth of illegal activity going on. Oddly the owner and a few otehrs are actuly going to jail. and you have Enron, Worldcom, Tyco, exxon I think still fighting and not paying its bill for Valdez...BP just flat out lying to us during the oil spill..just about daily. Company I use to work for made a whole bunch of moves, made quick bumps in profits, then ran off with the money as the company went down hill do the changes. ( short term gains, at expense of long term and then flee)

part of the problem is simple greed, but also part is we have a system in place where there is almost no check against the top of big companies doing what ever they want, and paying themself what ever they want. Part of that check...use to be Unions...and Boards are suppose to, but they are worthless as half the time they are just simply stacked with those who will do what they want...and in return there board someplace else does the same...

To often the Right simply tries to just pretend it does not exist, or its always just a few bad apples...Its alot easier to just scream communist at anyone who sees a unfair playing field loaded with cheats.

When corporations harm people then we need a watchdog government that will actually do its job.

When government harms people then we need a larger watchdog government...oh wait... we need a smaller government that focuses on its role and does not do what it should not.

Just this morning I was reading an article that said "the moral purpose of government was to redistribute wealth downward." I thought we had a secular government so that morality did not become the basis for a theocracy. I also thought that the constitution did not give that power to government.

 

[TruthSeeker]

Don't worry they will write it all off as donation to charity anyway...who knows maybe they can end up like GE and pay no taxes at all!

and not all corperations are evil...thats more or less a straw man argument. ( I say almost becuse yes there are some crazy nut job hippies that would say it...but its not even close to a majority)
But the fact is that our corporate culture today...has alot of greed and corruption in it. PO boxes offshore listed as corperate HQ to tax evasion? Just because they have greased enough pockets do make it "legal" does not make it less corrupt.
I mean look at the banks, the crap they where selling and knew was bad, but so long as it made a buck who cares ( and then when bailed out pay us huge bonus's for Fing up ). Our local news here has been watching one of the best known car dealerships here go down as they found...about 10 pages worth of illegal activity going on. Oddly the owner and a few otehrs are actuly going to jail. and you have Enron, Worldcom, Tyco, exxon I think still fighting and not paying its bill for Valdez...BP just flat out lying to us during the oil spill..just about daily. Company I use to work for made a whole bunch of moves, made quick bumps in profits, then ran off with the money as the company went down hill do the changes. ( short term gains, at expense of long term and then flee)

part of the problem is simple greed, but also part is we have a system in place where there is almost no check against the top of big companies doing what ever they want, and paying themself what ever they want. Part of that check...use to be Unions...and Boards are suppose to, but they are worthless as half the time they are just simply stacked with those who will do what they want...and in return there board someplace else does the same...

To often the Right simply tries to just pretend it does not exist, or its always just a few bad apples...Its alot easier to just scream communist at anyone who sees a unfair playing field loaded with cheats.

You make some great points, PFOS, and I can't disagree with much of what you state, but this is not a "left/right" issue.

This is an issue of both political parties closing their eyes while some corporations and most investment bankers engage in all sorts of illegal and unethical shenanigans, that ultimately trickle down to affect the average Joes like you and me.

And you better believe that greed is the major player in all of this, and in the instance of the really mentally unstable people who have brought this country to the brink of collapse, it's all just a big game of "how much can we get away with".

A complete overhaul of the tax system in this country is all that can save us now. The Fair Tax Plan is our only hope. No more loopholes. No more schemes like offshore bank accounts and overseas money laundering. No more Bernie Madoffs and Goldman Sachs and securities manipulations and stock market schemes.

 

[pocketfullofshells]

When corporations harm people then we need a watchdog government that will actually do its job.

When government harms people then we need a larger watchdog government...oh wait... we need a smaller government that focuses on its role and does not do what it should not.

Just this morning I was reading an article that said "the moral purpose of government was to redistribute wealth downward." I thought we had a secular government so that morality did not become the basis for a theocracy. I also thought that the constitution did not give that power to government.

its nice you read that it was goverments job to do that...seems they must suck at it, becuse the middle class and poor have been making less and less for years while the Rich get richer and there taxes get smaller....

And yes we do need more efficient government oversight of some things...that means though that we need to kill the Republican party so the can stop putting the wolves in charge of the hen house.

And government overreach? courts and elections ( with no more corporate free speech money to buy elections)

 

[TruthSeeker]

its nice you read that it was goverments job to do that...seems they must suck at it, becuse the middle class and poor have been making less and less for years while the Rich get richer and there taxes get smaller....

And yes we do need more efficient government oversight of some things...that means though that we need to kill the Republican party so the can stop putting the wolves in charge of the hen house.

And government overreach? courts and elections ( with no more corporate free speech money to buy elections)

Kill the Republican Party? So you favor a Monarchy then? One party rule forever? No elections? Just let the leftists rule this country forever?

Be careful, your communist beliefs are showing. Sometimes you really go off the deep end, PFOS. And sometimes you make sense. Maybe it has to do with medications, or Alzheimer's. I'm not sure.

How about we the people eliminate both current major political parties and find people who truly represent the people, without the power plays and backroom deals and lies and irresponsibility and all the other unsavory crap that goes on?

How about we the people eliminate the ability of labor unions to spend millions of dollars of union member's money to support political agendas and political parties?

How about we the people force the federal and state governments to live within their means, and we take away their no-limit credit cards?

 

[Dr.Who]

its nice you read that it was goverments job to do that...seems they must suck at it, becuse the middle class and poor have been making less and less for years while the Rich get richer and there taxes get smaller....

And yes we do need more efficient government oversight of some things...that means though that we need to kill the Republican party so the can stop putting the wolves in charge of the hen house.

And government overreach? courts and elections ( with no more corporate free speech money to buy elections)

They do seem to suck at it. But changing demographics is not harm.

Oversight is not what is needed. Just laws and enforcement against what should be illegal. Oversight is just a fancy way of saying "meddling for profit and power".

Free speech is free speech. You can't stop people from buying ads or supporting congressmen. You can stop congressmen from letting themselves be influenced by money.

 

[BigRob]

The rich do not put money in banks. Putting money in banks is the act of the financially naive; the interest rate is too small, inflation eats up the interest. The rich are not financially naive. The many poor however, deposit their meager savings in banks, not knowing any better.

They use their money in ways that yield better returns like day trading or "parasiting" (buy large amounts, sell when there is a slight increase in the price), a stock. It is notable however, that such a practice does little to nothing for the economy.

This is more insanity....rich people don't use banks? Are you serious?

Additionally, you are sitting here trying to tell us that "rich" people don't use their money because they are busy using it to day trade and look for higher returns....anyone else see the glaring contradiction?

 

[PLC1]

This is more insanity....rich people don't use banks? Are you serious?

Additionally, you are sitting here trying to tell us that "rich" people don't use their money because they are busy using it to day trade and look for higher returns....anyone else see the glaring contradiction?

Well, no one in their right mind keeps large amounts of money in passbook savings, as the rate of return is less than the rate of inflation. Of course, the rich do use banks however.