73% support the "Buffett Rule"

[dogtowner]

Well, obviously we are having some problem "creating" wealth right now. . . in fact we've had problem creating wealth for quite a few years. . . that hasn't kept the top 1% from getting wealthier. . .and leaving the middle class far behind!

so some are creating wealth and others are not.... kind of like always.

 

[GenSeneca]

But the chance to make it out of poverty today is worse than it was over the last 100 years,

That is simply inaccurate.

the accumulation of wealth in the top 1% (and even more in the top 0.1%) is unsustainable

This too is inaccurate.

You talk about people making millions of $ a year getting "poorer?" And you think that losing 2 or 3% of that "new found wealth would be unfair?

It would be unfortunate for everyone.

How much of the wealth should they freely accumulate while the rest of the population loses it? What would satisfy you? 50%? 60%? 75%?

Each individual should be free to accumulate as much wealth as they can honestly accumulate.

And where (especially in a bad economy) would you suggest they get that additional wealth. . .if not by robbing the middle class of the vestige of comfort and fairness?

Your biggest ideological hurdle is this belief that in order for one person to prosper that it must happen at the expense of someone else. That is simply not the case.

 

[GenSeneca]

those who do "well" do it at the expenses of the rest of us.

So a college student who gets an A on an exam is only able to get that A at the expense of the rest of the class? How many people have to get an F in order for that one person to get an A?

You said you went to college, would it have been "fair" of your professors to redistribute your grades in order for the underprivileged students to have a higher GPA? For instance, you get an A on a test while someone else gets an F, would you have argued for your professor to give both of you a C in order to make it fair? Or perhaps drop your grade to a B and give the person who failed a D? What would be fair?

 

[PLC1]

What begets wealth?

Does hard work and intelligence beget great wealth?
Or does wealth beget wealth?

If it's the former, than anyone who has a lot of money deserves everything that they can get.

If it's the latter, then it's more a matter of accident and luck.

 

[GenSeneca]

What begets wealth?

Does hard work and intelligence beget great wealth?
Or does wealth beget wealth?

If it's the former, than anyone who has a lot of money deserves everything that they can get.

If it's the latter, then it's more a matter of accident and luck.

Both... You could win the lottery and become insanely wealthy but statistically, most people who do win the lottery are broke again within 5 years. For people like Steve Jobs, Steve Wozniak, and Ronald Wayne, they used intelligence and hard work to create the Apple empire and not a single one of them have found themselves in the poor house.

So those who come into wealth by accident and/or luck tend to lose that wealth as a result of not having the requisite skills and discipline necessary to grow and/or maintain their wealth. Generally speaking, the same is not true of people who have actually earned their wealth.

 

[Openmind]

So a college student who gets an A on an exam is only able to get that A at the expense of the rest of the class? How many people have to get an F in order for that one person to get an A?

You said you went to college, would it have been "fair" of your professors to redistribute your grades in order for the underprivileged students to have a higher GPA? For instance, you get an A on a test while someone else gets an F, would you have argued for your professor to give both of you a C in order to make it fair? Or perhaps drop your grade to a B and give the person who failed a D? What would be fair?

My grades didn't affect anyone roses grades, as we were ont grades on the curve. But if the university had used the curve rating system, it is obvious that the grades of an outlier would have affected the curve, and therefore everyone's grades.

By the way, is it so incredible that "I" went to college? You are funny!
However, when a CEO expect his compensation package to be worth 400X the salary of one of his employee, and the corporation obviously has limite earning power on any given year, but especially in a down market, it is obvious that his greed affects the distribution of money that is assigned to each pay grade!

 

[GenSeneca]

My grades didn't affect anyone roses grades

How can that be?

I thought you believed that nobody could do well without it being at the expense of someone else....

Is wealth on a curve? If so, I think it would be fun for you to explain the wealth curve to all of us.

 

[pocketfullofshells]

How can that be?

I thought you believed that nobody could do well without it being at the expense of someone else....

Is wealth on a curve? If so, I think it would be fun for you to explain the wealth curve to all of us.

you just go start a company, with no workers, use no roads, also you have to be self educated, and all materials you use must be made by you with no help or shipping via anything you did not you yourself make....Now make it a fortune 500 company with those rules...

 

[Openmind]

How can that be?

I thought you believed that nobody could do well without it being at the expense of someone else....

Is wealth on a curve? If so, I think it would be fun for you to explain the wealth curve to all of us.

First, you would need to know about a curve thqt is not just a curve ball!

For the rest, have you noticed that you show all signs of being on the verge to losing your cool?

Your just not used to people answering you tic for tac, are you?

Well, get used to it. I will call you and anyone else on inconsistencies and non-sense. You obviously have a right to your opinions, but you do not have the right totake yor dogmatic "voice" and expect everyone to fall at your feet and agree with you when they in fact disagree.

You love our constitutional rights, and our individuality. . . Well, then you need to respect EVERYONE's individuality, and allow everyone to defend their opinions. . . Preferably without resorting to childish and silly comments, even if I find them kind of cute, like those of a little pouting boy!

 

[Gipper]

First, you would need to know about a curve thqt is not just a curve ball!

For the rest, have you noticed that you show all signs of being on the verge to losing your cool?

Your just not used to people answering you tic for tac, are you?

Well, get used to it. I will call you and anyone else on inconsistencies and non-sense. You obviously have a right to your opinions, but you do not have the right totake yor dogmatic "voice" and expect everyone to fall at your feet and agree with you when they in fact disagree.

You love our constitutional rights, and our individuality. . . Well, then you need to respect EVERYONE's individuality, and allow everyone to defend their opinions. . . Preferably without resorting to childish and silly comments, even if I find them kind of cute, like those of a little pouting boy!

Hahahahhaahahhh.....

That is too funny!!!!

 

[dogtowner]

you just go start a company, with no workers, use no roads, also you have to be self educated, and all materials you use must be made by you with no help or shipping via anything you did not you yourself make....Now make it a fortune 500 company with those rules...

sounds remarkably close to Microsoft.

 

[dogtowner]

However, when a CEO expect his compensation package to be worth 400X the salary of one of his employee, and the corporation obviously has limite earning power on any given year, but especially in a down market, it is obvious that his greed affects the distribution of money that is assigned to each pay grade!

the board decides he is worth it or not. and if the stockholders disagree, no dice.

 

[Openmind]

the board decides he is worth it or not. and if the stockholders disagree, no dice.

Sure! the board is a tiny number of elites who run around in the same circles, and function under the theory of "you scratch my back, I scratch yours!"

The regular stock holders (anyone holing less than 200,000 share, are dwarfed by the REAL owners!

don't tell me you don't know that?

 

[dogtowner]

Sure! the board is a tiny number of elites who run around in the same circles, and function under the theory of "you scratch my back, I scratch yours!"

The regular stock holders (anyone holing less than 200,000 share, are dwarfed by the REAL owners!

don't tell me you don't know that?

Those board members are responsible for producing value. That is the point of back scratching. While the holder of 100 shares may nhave little impact, put enough of them together then it garner's attention.

For being a rich liberal you sure seem uneducated about how your hubby made all that money.

example of back scratching not happening as you suggest.

 

[Dr.Who]

That is simply inaccurate.

I think it might be accurate that in bad economic times the chance of bettering ones place in life would be lower due to greater obstacles. 20% real unemployment would make it harder to get a job than in a market with 5% unemployment.

But chances are not the stuff on which we should make policy. Especially policy that is grossly unfair and goes against the ideals of the constitution.

OOps. I just read what Openmind said again. I was comparing a few recent years to some recent past years and saying that the ebb and flow of the economy would effect the chances of getting out of poverty. Openmind was comparing the chances today with the last hundred years regardless of the economy.

NO, you were right Gen, and Open was incorrect.