Global Warming..........

To answer the original question since I've been away for a long while...

I'm a meteorologist and understand the science. I know the strengths and weaknesses of arguments on both sides. And I believe....that I don't know if man's activities are warming the planet.

We put too much stock in the process of science, and too little in the uncertainties. I've done met modeling. The physics important to the processes of global warming occurs on a scale below the resolution of climate models, and therefore must be parameterized into terms that can be measured and modeled. What comes out is a simulation of the parameterization scheme, not the climate. How well the former relates to the latter hardly ever gets mentioned. There are real problems with the observations, as well. Bottom line--I think the uncertainties dwarf our understanding at this point.

The important thing is how do you take the science and its uncertainties and make reasonable policy decisions? This should be what we're debating.

Personally, I think we should transition to nuclear energy, with full reprocessing and development of mixed oxide reactors to burn the recycled fuel. This will minimize waste, and make the handling of the waste that remains far more tractable. For transportation, we should transition to electric vehicles as sufficient electrical generation infrastructure comes on line. Right now, we'd crash the grid if everyone had an electric car plugged in at night. In the meantime, we should exploit natural gas resources because it is a domestic fuel, and it'll hold us over until nuclear power comes on-line without enriching our enemies. Continuing to focus on energy efficiency is also a part of any comprehensive energy strategy. None of these steps would have to create economic havoc.

I believe man's inhumanity against their fellow man is still the greatest threat we face. We can handle the climate.
 
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thats because your talking about weather, not climate...

overall temps go up, some places will get much cooler..

climate change...

also rainfall will be off, sea levals changing, and many other issues...not just well its cold in one place and hot in another.

if the GLOBE is warming as in GLOBAL warming then it seems to me that the warming would be happening all over the planet.

I wonder if there were global warming alarmists during the end of the last ice age. I mean the globe was warming enough at that time to meld loads of ice from all over the planet. I guess if you look at it that way, then I am all for global warming.... till the next ice age that is...
 
Your provided links are not proof of solar activity melting the Martian ice caps. The first link includes the reason scientists think that the cap is melting (because of the great wobble in its cycle). The other link attributes it to normal seasonal "freeze-thaw" changes.
In short, there is less evidence that solar activity causes the reduction of the ice caps on Mars than there is that global warming of Earth is not man made.

Yep :)


You asked me to prove the ice caps on Mars were melting and I did. The reasons for the melting is solar activity, as I have talked about a number of times. Mars is further from the sun than earth right?

You seem to accept that the solar activity is enough to melt the ice caps on Mars while Mars is further from the Sun than the Earth is yet Earths problems are man not the sun.

Ugh!
 
Yep :)


You asked me to prove the ice caps on Mars were melting and I did. The reasons for the melting is solar activity, as I have talked about a number of times. Mars is further from the sun than earth right?

You seem to accept that the solar activity is enough to melt the ice caps on Mars while Mars is further from the Sun than the Earth is yet Earths problems are man not the sun.

Ugh!
No, I do not accept that (unusual, sun spots, solar flares, etc.),solar activity is melting the ice caps on Mars. Your links indicated that most of the scientists attribute the melting to normal seasonal fluctuations not unusual solar events.

Earth also has normal seasonal waxing and waning of the polar ice caps that has nothing to do with unusual solar activity.

Also noteworthy is that the "ice" caps on Mars are not water ice, but frozen carbon dioxide or "dry ice" which sublimates at very low temperature (-54deg.C, depending upon atmospheric pressure, which would be very low on Mars).
 
No, I do not accept that (unusual, sun spots, solar flares, etc.),solar activity is melting the ice caps on Mars. Your links indicated that most of the scientists attribute the melting to normal seasonal fluctuations not unusual solar events.

Earth also has normal seasonal waxing and waning of the polar ice caps that has nothing to do with unusual solar activity.

Also noteworthy is that the "ice" caps on Mars are not water ice, but frozen carbon dioxide or "dry ice" which sublimates at very low temperature (-54deg.C, depending upon atmospheric pressure, which would be very low on Mars).

Climate is usually referenced as a running 20 year average of observed weather. The sun's solar cycle is 11 years, so two cycles cover about one "climatic" period, so to speak. The sun's activity is not constant, and neither is climate. See: Sunspot History.

The radiative equilibrium temperature of the earth does not change unless the albedo changes, so if greenhouse gas emissions warm one part of the planet, another part must cool to maintain equilibrium. This could mean that the near surface layer of the atmosphere would heat, while the upper part of the atmosphere would cool. This would lead to more thunderstorms, rain, etc, that would act to counter the observed effect. Also, the reverse could happen--the lower atmosphere cool while the upper atmosphere warmed. This would also have a negative feedback that would act to counter the effect. Finally, the equator could warm and the poles cool, which would lead to more frequent and more powerful weather systems (warmer heat waves, colder cold fronts). I think the latter scenario is most likely, but would be very difficult to pick out of the climatological record, especially given the natural variability of climate.
 
Who gives a flying turd burger about the ice caps on Mars for christs sake.........

It is the current rhetoric of the conservatives, that our increased temperature is caused by natural means (increased solar activity), as evidenced by the Mars ice cap reduction. You have to stay current, although she does not understand the science behind it, she is willing to repeat the rhetoric.
 
Jeeeez people...............

The reason that Mars turned into a shrivelled up wasteland is that its atmosphere got blown away because it has no magnetosphere - magnetic shield that deflects high energy solar particles!!

Please folks lets stick to reality!!!!
 
Watching the Open Championship at the holiest of holy golf courses, St. Andrews. What a wonderful golf tournament...

And, looks pretty damn cold there is old Scotland....but then it usually is.

You at the tournament Scotty?
 
if the GLOBE is warming as in GLOBAL warming then it seems to me that the warming would be happening all over the planet.

I wonder if there were global warming alarmists during the end of the last ice age. I mean the globe was warming enough at that time to meld loads of ice from all over the planet. I guess if you look at it that way, then I am all for global warming.... till the next ice age that is...

I will tell science that you don't agree with how it works things, you can take it up with it.After all it should just work how you think right?
 
I will tell science that you don't agree with how it works things, you can take it up with it.After all it should just work how you think right?

No... Thngs should not work the way I say just because I say.

But they should make sense! And they should be about more than just another way to tax people and that is ALL this man made global warming stuff is, a new reason to tax people.

Why is it that liberals never feel the need to explain the logic of what they believe at the same time they demand every detail of what a conservative believes... I will never know but I guess it does not matter anyways.

Though it would be nice to know how global warming would make colder weather anyplace on the planet, liberals will never feel compelled to explain it.
 
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No... Thngs should not work the way I say just because I say.

But they should make sense! And they should be about more than just another way to tax people and that is ALL this man made global warming stuff is, a new reason to tax people.

Why is it that liberals never feel the need to explain the logic of what they believe at the same time they demand every detail of what a conservative believes... I will never know but I guess it does not matter anyways.

Though it would be nice to know how global warming would make colder weather anyplace on the planet, liberals will never feel compelled to explain it.

if you don't know, then its clear you have never bothered to really look at the issue..and you don't care. It does not matter at all, your going to belive that there is none, regardless what we tell you. If you really wanted to know, and really want to be open, you would just go read some about it
 
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