Global Warming..........

CoachV40

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As the tendency seems to be the conversation in threads seems to move towards different subjects towards the end of the debate. So as the Fat Albert thread moves towards a Global Warming subject matter, I thought I would actually start a thread. Now I'm sure this isn't the first thread on this subject in the HOP, but it is the most recent. I would like to know where the members of the HOP forum fall on this subject, especially since this is soon to be back in the headlines in the coming months, as the administration tries to move towards a Cap and Trade type bill. As I tell my students and ask of others I want to know why you believe something. A simple because doesn't work for me. I'm not going to post anything else other than this until at least some response is made. My reason for this is because I don't want to start the conversation out on a soap box. I will gladly share my complete belief on this subject and the reasons that I believe what I believe.
 
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Many people in U.S. care about whether or not it's real. Simply because they stand to see their taxes increased significatly to pay for something that in my opinion isn't real. I will agree though a lot of money is being made by some people, but those that are making the most money are the ones feeding the lie. Isn't that fraud? I've seen comparisons to Madoff that have been made. If I say give me this $$$$ to buy carbon credits, and in return I'm gonna plant some trees/invest in wind energy (or whatever). You need to help us fight this or the world is gonna flood, polar bears are gonna die, and people will die. Then we discover it's not true, is that not fraud? So the science may not be a big deal of whether it's real or a lie. The things that are trying to be done based on something thats not proven is the extreme problem. Keep in mind these are the same people that said a second ice age was coming back 20 some years ago.
 
The original dichotomy. There are groups of scientists that will prove beyond doubt that AGW is real and is a planetary threat likewise there are those that will prove beyond doubt its not. No doubt as this thread progresses all the usual links claiming and counter claiming will be trotted out which is great news for Wiki!

The point is.....so what!

There are lobby groups around that are making millions by doing exactly what you are doing which is perpetuating the discussion! Give people oxygen and they will use it, deny them oxygen and the discussion dies. This debate is ultimately about money and how best to extract it from poeple; the pitch being that your "green" taxes will contribute to improving the environment. This line is accepted by a section of the population who are happy as they feel that they are contributing to the environment and making the world a better place for their children. The scientists are happy because they are benefitting from the revenues raised in the form of research grants, bursaries and funding streams which ultimately provides employment for themselves, research assistances, support staff etc. etc. Governments are happy because they have actually tapped into a new taxation stream which they can justify because the scientists tell them they can.

Everyone's happy except those that don't agree and to them.......well tough.....lifes a b1tch!
 
its a pointless debate, those who don't believe in it...pretty much I have come to believe don't care about what science says, 1000 major studies...if they can find one that they like regardless if BP and Exxon paid for it...thats the only one they will believe. Not the UN, or White House ( under Republicans) reports will change anything...regardless of even Pentagon and Military reports dealing with it...they will never believe it...because they don't want to.

This simple idea that if you pump Billions and billions of Pounds of Pollution and CO2 in the air...it will not have any effect on anything...will always win to them.

Oddly for all the proof they demand, many belive in a man in sky with mythical powers and some of there leaders think Hurricanes happen because of gays, Earthquakes, from Abortion..
 
Even the people who do believe that man caused global warming/cooling/whatever, have never been able to come up with a single study or set of evidence proving their contention. But that hasn't stopped them from demanding that we completely change our lifestyles and devote the major part of the world's resources to "doing something about it" - as if that were possible in the first place.

Every "study" the global-whatever advocates cite, points to another report by supposedly "learned scientists". But that report, in turn, contains no actual proof or comprehensive evidence of man having anything to do with whatever the climate is doing this week. It merely refers to yet another "study". And - you guess it - that study points to yet another study... which points to another, etc. etc. There has never been ANY actual proof... despite the shrill rhetoric of the global-whatever believers.

Manmade Global Warming is the greatest hoax of our lifetimes (because Social Security was started before most of us were alive). The good news is, most people recognize it as a hoax, so it is withering on the vine, getting support from only a few governments and other leftist groups.
 
its a pointless debate, those who don't believe in it...pretty much I have come to believe don't care about what science says, 1000 major studies...if they can find one that they like regardless if BP and Exxon paid for it...thats the only one they will believe. Not the UN, or White House ( under Republicans) reports will change anything...regardless of even Pentagon and Military reports dealing with it...they will never believe it...because they don't want to.

This simple idea that if you pump Billions and billions of Pounds of Pollution and CO2 in the air...it will not have any effect on anything...will always win to them.

Oddly for all the proof they demand, many belive in a man in sky with mythical powers and some of there leaders think Hurricanes happen because of gays, Earthquakes, from Abortion..

Amazing how easy it is to get otherwise intelligent people to believe a hoax. There must be a way in which I can make millions off these fools.

Could it be liberals will always believe whatever their leaders tell them? It does not matter that their leaders are making Billions and Billions of dollars off this hoax. If it were conservatives making Billions and Billions, I kind of doubt the liberals would go along with it.

Everything is political with libs.
 
Global warming is a fact. There is all kinds of evidence to prove it. However, the real question is: Is global warming the result of man's activities or is the current warming either a natural occurrence.

The pro-man's involvement people seem to be obsessed with the fact that it is happening to the point where they will not look at any evidence that it is natural.

Nevertheless, many of the natural occurrence people are similar in their conviction that it is a politically motivated hoax and likewise will not entertain the concept that it may be man caused.

My conviction is that is more likely to be man-made than not, but have no faith that man will over come the effects. Man kind may as well bend over and kiss his butt good-bye.
 
Global warming is a fact. There is all kinds of evidence to prove it. However, the real question is: Is global warming the result of man's activities or is the current warming either a natural occurrence.

The pro-man's involvement people seem to be obsessed with the fact that it is happening to the point where they will not look at any evidence that it is natural.

Nevertheless, many of the natural occurrence people are similar in their conviction that it is a politically motivated hoax and likewise will not entertain the concept that it may be man caused.

My conviction is that is more likely to be man-made than not, but have no faith that man will over come the effects. Man kind may as well bend over and kiss his butt good-bye.

How is it a fact? As was pointed out earlier there is no hard evidence. Al Gore's move has been largely contradicted...i.e. the hockey stick graph and the ice melting in the glass of water and then over flowing. Apparently the ice water guys never heard of water displacement but I digress. My point is there is no hard evidence and we've gotten cooler over the past few years. Most people recognize the ice caps aren't melting so Gore even back off of that for the most part. So my question is why are some people happy to stand to the side allow the government to hike there taxes and control their lives over something that hasn't been proven? And why is it that everyone that is preaching it are the ones that have become millionaires on the back of Global Warming?
 
Please don't get me wrong. If you want to recycle more power to you, if you want to practice water conservation more power to you, if you want to drive a prius, eat organic, and use curly light bulbs more of the same. That is your right and freedom to do as a red blooded free American. I also believe that we should be respectful of the world God gave us and take care of it. You want find me out dumping oil into the stream behind my house, or burrying chemicals in my backyard. All that being said if I want to drive a SUV thats my right, if I want to leave the lights on all night and keep the A/C at 72 thats my right because I'm paying for it. So having said all of that my point is this, with nothing solid to base this off of why should I be OK with my taxes being raised, the government dictating to me what my energy consumption should be etc?.?
 
Please don't get me wrong. If you want to recycle more power to you, if you want to practice water conservation more power to you, if you want to drive a prius, eat organic, and use curly light bulbs more of the same. That is your right and freedom to do as a red blooded free American. I also believe that we should be respectful of the world God gave us and take care of it. You want find me out dumping oil into the stream behind my house, or burrying chemicals in my backyard. All that being said if I want to drive a SUV thats my right, if I want to leave the lights on all night and keep the A/C at 72 thats my right because I'm paying for it. So having said all of that my point is this, with nothing solid to base this off of why should I be OK with my taxes being raised, the government dictating to me what my energy consumption should be etc?.?

see you want " proof" but you know that there will never be some smoking gun "proof" regardless if its true or not because of all the variables and crap. But what we can say, is that evry major study, UN, US Goverment ( even Bush's own) all come back with same thing..Man is causing it.

how about you prove that dumping pollution and huge amounts of CO2 has zero effect on the earths temp.
 
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how about you prove that dumping pollution and huge amounts of CO2 has zero effect on the earths temp.

Seems like that is easy to do. There are known periods in history that were blistering hot and also several ice ages and all before cars and industry.

The ice caps are melting on mars where there are zero SUV's and no factory's

Where our equator is now is not where it always was, where our polls are now is not where they always were, they have shifted through out time. Where lush gardens were is now ice and where there is now ice, once lush gardens grew.

It snowed last April here, and we hardly ever get snow even in the cold months.

The weather on this planet has gone through drastic extremes from cold to hot to cold to hot and all before men ever invented the car.

also, how is it that co2 is a bad poison when its what all of us exhale and what all plants eat ??


They screamed global cooling for years then changed it to global warming till they kept getting snowed out of their conventions in April and now they want to call it climate change. Well there is documented proof that the climate has always been changing even before there were people.

One easy thing to look at is the sun. The last year there have been almost no sun spots and it was much cooler even in the warm months. The sun is starting to act up again and we will more than likely see more heat. But not because of us, just because the sun has a cycle.
 
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