I'm not too terribly familiar with this theory, but it's the most plausible one I've seen to date. It seems reasonable that the handful of good emperors may simply have not been enough to withstand the damge wrought by all the bad ones.
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Why did Rome fall?
- Thread starter SW85
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I'm not too terribly familiar with this theory, but it's the most plausible one I've seen to date. It seems reasonable that the handful of good emperors may simply have not been enough to withstand the damge wrought by all the bad ones.
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Indeed. I'm getting further into Grant's book and I am surprised to find that the good emperors were largely sandwiched in the principate, the earlier, less troubled half of the empire. Of the seven I've identified so far as mostly worthwhile rulers (Augustus, Vespasian, Nerva, Trajan, Hadrian, Antoninus Pius, and Marcus Aurelius), five of them ruled back-to-back in a period remarkably devoid of trouble.
The instability of the imperial system itself seems to have been a major trouble: between the Praetorians and distant legions, emperors were constantly fighting to shore up their reign. The Crisis of the Third Century, in which something like 20-30 emperors reigned in a span of 50 years (each one arriving in Rome long enough to kill his predecessor and reign for an average of two years), resulted in Rome breaking into three distinct, although short-lived, empires -- Gallic in the west, Palmyrene in the east. This was only averted, again, by a few decent emperors (Aurelian and Claudius II 'Gothicus'), but Rome came perilously close to death in those troubled years.
The instability of the imperial system itself seems to have been a major trouble: between the Praetorians and distant legions, emperors were constantly fighting to shore up their reign. The Crisis of the Third Century, in which something like 20-30 emperors reigned in a span of 50 years (each one arriving in Rome long enough to kill his predecessor and reign for an average of two years), resulted in Rome breaking into three distinct, although short-lived, empires -- Gallic in the west, Palmyrene in the east. This was only averted, again, by a few decent emperors (Aurelian and Claudius II 'Gothicus'), but Rome came perilously close to death in those troubled years.
Rome fell because it lost control of its borders and allowed too many barbarians to enter illegally, it spent money it didn't have and tried to make up the difference by printing more, it tried to impose a pax romana on the rest of the world through force of arms, and it tried to maintain a welfare state and keep the populace happy with bread and circuses. Furthermore, it became possible to purchase a seat on the Roman senate.
Given such decadance, it is no wonder the empire fell apart. Isn't it a good thing that we've learned from the mistakes of the Romans?
Given such decadance, it is no wonder the empire fell apart. Isn't it a good thing that we've learned from the mistakes of the Romans?
Beetle Bailey
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Rome fell because it lost control of its borders and allowed too many barbarians to enter illegally, it spent money it didn't have and tried to make up the difference by printing more, it tried to impose a pax romana on the rest of the world through force of arms, and it tried to maintain a welfare state and keep the populace happy with bread and circuses. Furthermore, it became possible to purchase a seat on the Roman senate.
Given such decadance, it is no wonder the empire fell apart. Isn't it a good thing that we've learned from the mistakes of the Romans?
See what I mean. History is always made more relevant to modern contemporary agenda than it is to actual historical events.
steveox
Well-Known Member
The Same way america is going to fall because people cheer on this sick ****!
Kane set MVP on fire in a ring fire match.MVP suffered 2nd degree burns how can people cheer for this ****? ITS SICK!!! Im Suiprised Vince hasnt fired Teddy Long for abusing his authority as General Manager of Smackdown.Samething its Sick People cheered on the Lions attacking christains in rome THATS HOW ROME FELL!
Kane set MVP on fire in a ring fire match.MVP suffered 2nd degree burns how can people cheer for this ****? ITS SICK!!! Im Suiprised Vince hasnt fired Teddy Long for abusing his authority as General Manager of Smackdown.Samething its Sick People cheered on the Lions attacking christains in rome THATS HOW ROME FELL!
Napoleon
Well-Known Member
A few important factors which you missed:
1. The migration of barbarian hordes from the North and Western Europe shifted the balance of power significantly in the Western Roman Empire. Rome enlisted some of these hordes to fight off it's new enemies. In doing so, the Empire taught the barbarians all of their military tactics; a mistake which would haunt them for generations as they turned what few allies they had into enemies.
2. Disease. Many of the towns and villages in southern Gaul and northern Italy were either abandoned or the inhabitants already dead by the time the barbarians reached them. It's obviously not too difficult to conquer territories when there's no one around to stop you.
3. For all intents and purposes the Eastern portion of the Empire had abandoned the West. Despite pleas from the Pope, the Eastern Empire refused to send reinforcements using economics and fear of spreading the plague as an excuse. So, the Pope cut a deal. The barbarians could have everything but Rome. They agreed because their leaders had already been converted to Christianity.
1. The migration of barbarian hordes from the North and Western Europe shifted the balance of power significantly in the Western Roman Empire. Rome enlisted some of these hordes to fight off it's new enemies. In doing so, the Empire taught the barbarians all of their military tactics; a mistake which would haunt them for generations as they turned what few allies they had into enemies.
2. Disease. Many of the towns and villages in southern Gaul and northern Italy were either abandoned or the inhabitants already dead by the time the barbarians reached them. It's obviously not too difficult to conquer territories when there's no one around to stop you.
3. For all intents and purposes the Eastern portion of the Empire had abandoned the West. Despite pleas from the Pope, the Eastern Empire refused to send reinforcements using economics and fear of spreading the plague as an excuse. So, the Pope cut a deal. The barbarians could have everything but Rome. They agreed because their leaders had already been converted to Christianity.
The empire banned the sentencing of Christians to the gladiatorial arena more than a hundred years before the empire fell, and the games themselves were ended permanently not long after.
Napoleon, everything you mention is correct and is commonly cited as one of the reasons Rome fell, but I'd posit that every problem Rome suffered in its last few decades was dramatically worsened by the absence of good men to steer the empire through its troubles. For a time there in the middle of the third century it seemed the empire was simply doomed; but it experienced a military recovery under men like Claudius II and Aurelian, and they only ruled for maybe a combined decade. Thanks to them, the empire lasted another two centuries. Ditto with Diocletian, and perhaps again with the first Valentinian.
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You never heard the story about how Nero fiddled while Rome burned?
Reminds me a little of Cheney.