What a sad, truly sad statement about our homophobic way of thinking!

[GenSeneca]

Why are some American's rights up for a vote?

You should be the one to answer that question.

 

[Sihouette]

You've once again made a baseless statement. You have yet to prove that "deviant sexual behavior" is made as opposed to being born.~Mare

What? You were the one who just made a "baseless" comment that bigots are made, not born that way. How do you know people aren't born with an aversion towards others that don't behave or look like them?

You twist and spin to beat the band Mare. Which is it? Are behaviors inborn or acquired. Which ones? And how is it that you are qualified to opine on them and I am not? Who is being the intolerant one here?

 

[Mare Tranquillity]

You should be the one to answer that question.

No more than you. Your one-sided denial of force is hypocrisy of the worst sort. Now that the rich have most of the money it's a level playing field in GenSeca Land. So if I come to your side and argue that being rich in a world of poverty is a level playing field, will you argue for transsexual rights?

 

[Mare Tranquillity]

What? You were the one who just made a "baseless" comment that bigots are made, not born that way. How do you know people aren't born with an aversion towards others that don't behave or look like them?

You twist and spin to beat the band Mare. Which is it? Are behaviors inborn or acquired. Which ones? And how is it that you are qualified to opine on them and I am not? Who is being the intolerant one here?

Yep, white babies are born hating n1ggers. Your endless attempts to make it black and white expose you poor intellectual attainment.

I'm in a better position to talk about myself because I have lived my life, not you. I'm in a better position to discuss transsexualism because not only am I one, I have also spent a couple of decades studying it and participating in research projects about it. Go back to the barn and abuse another animal, you'll feel better after you do I'm sure.

Is it intolerant of me to say that you don't know what you're talking about? I don't think so, it's just the truth. As soon as you get an education you'll be able to discuss with the adults too. You still haven't defined sdb, Siho?

 

[GenSeneca]

No more than you. Your one-sided denial of force is hypocrisy of the worst sort.

I'm the only of us that has argued against allowing a voting majority to violate the rights of others. You are the one who has been arguing in favor of violating rights, not me.

 

[Mare Tranquillity]

I'm the only of us that has argued against allowing a voting majority to violate the rights of others. You are the one who has been arguing in favor of violating rights, not me.

That's correct, you favor the hegemony of the rich minority and I support the countervailing force of the numbers of poor. The vast accumulation of wealth in the hands of a tiny minority is an example of how successful the rich and powerful are in using their force. The millions of people losing their homes, the lack of adequate medical care that is affordable for all, the huge numbers of homeless people, and the high percentage of people out of work shows again how successfully the power of the rich has been and how powerless the ballot box has become. And you have the temerity to say that this is a level playing field.

Like Cap Pig, you seem to advocate the rapacious lifestyle indulged in at the expense of others.

 

[GenSeneca]

And you have the temerity to say that this is a level playing field.

Nope, I have said repeatedly that we need to have laws that protect the rights of every individual in order to have a level playing field and we do not have such laws. You don't want a level playing field, you want it slanted your direction and that's why you don't recognize a level field as being level.

Like Cap Pig, you seem to advocate the rapacious lifestyle indulged in at the expense of others.

That is your position. I have been the one arguing in favor of individual rights, in favor of a mutually beneficial society. You have been the one arguing in favor of violating rights, arguing in favor of using force against some for the benefit of others. You are only fooling yourself by claiming otherwise.

 

[Mare Tranquillity]

Nope, I have said repeatedly that we need to have laws that protect the rights of every individual in order to have a level playing field and we do not have such laws. You don't want a level playing field, you want it slanted your direction and that's why you don't recognize a level field as being level.


That is your position. I have been the one arguing in favor of individual rights, in favor of a mutually beneficial society. You have been the one arguing in favor of violating rights, arguing in favor of using force against some for the benefit of others. You are only fooling yourself by claiming otherwise.

You say I don't want a level playing field, I say you don't want one. You say we have one, I say we don't. While I like the idea of a mutally beneficial society, I don't think it can be built on the disparity of wealth extant in our country today. Without the repeal of many laws and regulations, and the prosecution of the people who have used those laws to enrich themselves at the expense of others we will never have a mutually beneficial society.

 

[dogtowner]

I don't think you should, in fact you've had the home court advantage for too long, all men, but white men especially. Please note who could vote when this country was first founded. How long was it before blacks and Chinese and American Indians could vote? How long before women could vote?

Look at a list of the highest paid people in this country, a list of the CEO's, or a list of the richest individuals.

People of color are still executed at a much higher rate than white people too.

But if unequal was wrong before then its wrong now. The rest is meaningless.

 

[Mare Tranquillity]

But if unequal was wrong before then its wrong now. The rest is meaningless.

That's the problem with black and white thinking, it takes away the grey shades we have in the real world. It's not the inequality per se, it's the degree of inequality that is the issue. When some people have billions and some people live under bridges with nothing but the clothes on their backs THAT is too much inequality. Like in the eastern religious outlook where one seeks to find the middle path, to remain in balance. Enforced hunger is a good example of a situation with shades of grey. You can be just a bit peckish or you can be dead from starvation, but there are many gradations in between. In much of the European Union they have limited the amount that can be paid to a CEO to something like 1000 times what the lowest paid employee gets just so that they can limit the concentration of wealth and keep the disparity between rich and poor mor narrow.

 

[Sihouette]

Yep, white babies are born hating n1ggers. Your endless attempts to make it black and white expose you poor intellectual attainment.

I'm in a better position to talk about myself because I have lived my life, not you. I'm in a better position to discuss transsexualism because not only am I one, I have also spent a couple of decades studying it and participating in research projects about it. Go back to the barn and abuse another animal, you'll feel better after you do I'm sure.~Mare

Wow, I feel certain if I misquoted you and used it to ad hominem you, I'd be banned from posting here by now. If I wrote the post above and continued to spew the vitriol you do in response to simple probing, I know I would be banned by now.

The adminstration no doubt takes pity on your situation, but still you're here attacking so what to do?

I'll ask it again: how is it that you can determine some behavior, like bigotry for instance, is something that is made, not born into and then go on to say I'm in the wrong for saying homosexuality is made, not born into? Do you have a degree in Anthropology? In Behavioral Psychology? Done exahaustive studies to come to your conclusion? No? Because that's what you demand for any position here offered against mainstreaming homosexuality by setting the precident through revoking DADT.

Duly noted that your heated denialism appears to be escalating.

 

[Mare Tranquillity]

Wow, I feel certain if I misquoted you and used it to ad hominem you, I'd be banned from posting here by now. If I wrote the post above and continued to spew the vitriol you do in response to simple probing, I know I would be banned by now.

The adminstration no doubt takes pity on your situation, but still you're here attacking so what to do?

I'll ask it again: how is it that you can determine some behavior, like bigotry for instance, is something that is made, not born into and then go on to say I'm in the wrong for saying homosexuality is made, not born into? Do you have a degree in Anthropology? In Behavioral Psychology? Done exahaustive studies to come to your conclusion? No? Because that's what you demand for any position here offered against mainstreaming homosexuality by setting the precident through revoking DADT.

Duly noted that your heated denialism appears to be escalating.

I do the same that I do for everyone else, I give them the benefit of the doubt. Gay people should not have to PROVE their value in order to be treated equally--YOU don't have to do that, I don't have to do that, no one does, except gay people.

This will come as a suprise to you I'm sure, but under US law you are INNOCENT until PROVEN guilty. There is no evidence that gay people cause anywhere near the harm that heterosexual people cause, so why not judge them individually on their merit?

At one time in Jewish society a woman who wanted an education had to masquerade as a male--one of the first DADT situations. It was just as stupid then as now.

 

[ASPCA4EVER]

I do the same that I do for everyone else, I give them the benefit of the doubt. Gay people should not have to PROVE their value in order to be treated equally--YOU don't have to do that, I don't have to do that, no one does, except gay people.

This will come as a suprise to you I'm sure, but under US law you are INNOCENT until PROVEN guilty. There is no evidence that gay people cause anywhere near the harm that heterosexual people cause, so why not judge them individually on their merit?

At one time in Jewish society a woman who wanted an education had to masquerade as a male--one of the first DADT situations. It was just as stupid then as now.

Well stated Mare...couldn't agree more. DADT needs to be repealed it was established under a false sense of AIDS hysteria that was rolling across America and many a homophobic heterosexual male lived in fear and loathing of catching AIDS from a gay...all the while not thinking about that last night rendezvous with the 'HO' of his choice for the evening

 

[Mare Tranquillity]

The evidences continue to build up.

The arrangement of a mother's genes could affect the sexual orientation of her son, according to a new study.

The finding, detailed in the February issue of the journal Human Genetics, adds fuel to the decade-long debate about whether so-called "gay genes" might exist.

The researchers examined a phenomenon called "X chromosome inactivation" in 97 mothers of gay sons and 103 mothers whose sons were not gay.
http://www.livescience.com/health/060224_gay_genes.html

A new study shows that gay men respond differently from straight men when exposed to a suspected sexual stimulus found in male sweat.

When homosexual men smelled the odor of male sweat—more specifically, a chemical in the male hormone testosterone—their brains responded similarly to those of women. The findings suggest that brain activity and sexual orientation are linked. It also supports an opinion held by most scientists, that people are born—not bred—gay.
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2005/05/0510_050510_gayscent.html


Smelling a male pheromone prompts the same brain activity in homosexual men as it does in heterosexual women, a new study has found. It did not excite the sex-related region in the brains of heterosexual males, although an oestrogen-derived compound found in female urine did.

The testosterone-derived chemical AND is found in male sweat and is believed to be a pheromone. It activated the anterior hypothalamus and medial preoptic area of gay men and straight women alike. Researchers led by Ivanka Savic at the Karolinska University Hospital in Sweden believe this brain region integrates the hormonal and sensory cues used in guiding sexual behaviour.
http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn7358-pheromone-attracts-straight-women-and-gay-men.html

 

[dogtowner]

The evidences continue to build up.

The arrangement of a mother's genes could affect the sexual orientation of her son, according to a new study.

The finding, detailed in the February issue of the journal Human Genetics, adds fuel to the decade-long debate about whether so-called "gay genes" might exist.

The researchers examined a phenomenon called "X chromosome inactivation" in 97 mothers of gay sons and 103 mothers whose sons were not gay.
http://www.livescience.com/health/060224_gay_genes.html

A new study shows that gay men respond differently from straight men when exposed to a suspected sexual stimulus found in male sweat.

When homosexual men smelled the odor of male sweat—more specifically, a chemical in the male hormone testosterone—their brains responded similarly to those of women. The findings suggest that brain activity and sexual orientation are linked. It also supports an opinion held by most scientists, that people are born—not bred—gay.
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2005/05/0510_050510_gayscent.html


Smelling a male pheromone prompts the same brain activity in homosexual men as it does in heterosexual women, a new study has found. It did not excite the sex-related region in the brains of heterosexual males, although an oestrogen-derived compound found in female urine did.

The testosterone-derived chemical AND is found in male sweat and is believed to be a pheromone. It activated the anterior hypothalamus and medial preoptic area of gay men and straight women alike. Researchers led by Ivanka Savic at the Karolinska University Hospital in Sweden believe this brain region integrates the hormonal and sensory cues used in guiding sexual behaviour.
http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn7358-pheromone-attracts-straight-women-and-gay-men.html

these studies are new to you ? I thought you were up to date on this stuff.

of note in the National Geo article

Hamer cautions that the gay men's different brain activity could be either a cause of their sexual orientation or an effect of it.