Vince Foster was murdered by the Clintons - the evidence you never saw

[Coyote]

Yes, you really do sound childish. Time for you to go back to your playstation.

Silly girl

 

[Coyote]

They had access to the suicide note also - and they botched it.

Three seperate independent investigations botched it? That's stretching credability to the limits.

 

[Popeye]

They had access to the suicide note also - and they botched it.

This whole debate is ridiculous. Three separate official investigations, one headed by Ken Starr, ruled Vince Foster's death a suicide. Yet I get the impression 300 investigations could rule his death a suicide and you wouldn't be happy.

I suppose I could look back over your posts, but just let me ask, do you believe 9/11 was an inside job? Because it seems to me like you're just one of those people who loves conspiracy theories.

 

[palerider]

Why 3 investigations? For the same reason we spent untold millions of taxpayer dollars investigating what finally ended up being a Presidential infidelity. Clinton's presidency can best be characterized as one massive, wasteful Republican witchhunt trying to find anything they could on Clinton.

See how well all the investigations worked. After all that, you sit there thinking that it was about presidential infidelity. It was about perjury and the subject matter is completely irrelavent. If a person can decide what he will and will not tell the truth about under oath, then exactly what good is our legal system?

Should I list off the number of convictions and prison sentences that came out that "wasted" money? You would have prefered that the criminials remain uncharged and working at the highest levels of government?

And do you need to be reminded that clinton was disbarred. Not for getting a bj but for comitting a crime? And considering that the evidence was overwhelming enough to get him disbarred but not convicted in congress, one must wonder if the clinton's illegal posession of 900 raw FBI files on political enemies, the families of political enemies, and those who may become political enemies had something to do with their reluctance to convict him on the overwhelming evidence.

Congress pushed the investigations and Congress was Republican led. If three investigations fail to change the verdict of suicide - well how many more will it take to convince you? None, I think - because you will never believe otherwise will you?

Pardon me, but I am not one to turn off my brain, and ignore facts because some congressmen tell me a thing whether I agree with them or not. They have apparently told you that vince was able to suspend the laws of physics and bypass human physiology for his suicide and you simply say OK?

I will be convinced when someone addresses the facts, rather than simply telling me to ignore them and believe what they say. You apparently place much stock in those investigations, and have based your position on their findings. So tell me, how did the investigations address the following facts:

* There was no blood or tissue on the gun or foster's hand and only a trickle of blood was noted running out of his mouth by the crime scene investigators. The force of a gunshot within the mouth blows back large amounts of blood and tissue.

* Fosters fingerprints were not found on the gun in his hand. Two fingerprints were found under the grips however, and no attempt was made to identify who they belonged to. Further, the gun was made of parts of at least two guns and there is neither any evidence that the gun belonged to foster, nor any evidence that it fired the fatal shot.

* The gunpowder residue found on fosters glasses, clothing, and in his mouth did not come from the gun in his hand.

* No skull fragments were ever found at the scene of the crime even though it is stated that he had a large exit wound in the back of his skull.

There are others, but these will suffice for now. There are valid and very basic questions concering these facts and any competent investigation, seeking the truth would have sought to answer them. Now tell me, what were the findings of your congressional investigation regarding these facts? I will tell you what they are to save you the time it would take you to do a google search. The questions were completely ignored. They were never addressed. They became lost in the flurry of investigations.

Now, considering that these facts have never been addressed, and the obvious questions they prompt have never been answered on what basis, exactly, do you accept the story that you have apparently accepted?

And if you accept the findings from congress on these investigations considering that very important questions have not even been acknowledged, much less addressed, on what basis do you reject anything that the government tells you?

 

[palerider]

This whole debate is ridiculous. Three separate official investigations, one headed by Ken Starr, ruled Vince Foster's death a suicide. Yet I get the impression 300 investigations could rule his death a suicide and you wouldn't be happy.

A single investigation that addresses the troubing facts listed above would satisfy me. Maybe you can tell me what the findings were with regard to those very basic facts.

I suppose I could look back over your posts, but just let me ask, do you believe 9/11 was an inside job? Because it seems to me like you're just one of those people who loves conspiracy theories.

Feel free. You will find that I don't believe 9/11 was an inside job because the facts and evidence don't support the theory just like the facts and evidence don't support suicide in the case of vince foster's death.

 

[Coyote]

See how well all the investigations worked. After all that, you sit there thinking that it was about presidential infidelity. It was about perjury and the subject matter is completely irrelavent. If a person can decide what he will and will not tell the truth about under oath, then exactly what good is our legal system?

No, I never thought it was about presidential infidelity. I use that as a deliberate means of showing how ridiculous a fiasco the whole witchhunt turned into. It turned into an investigation of infidelity that ended with perjury. Do I agree with perjury? Hell no. But I also think the investigation should never have gotten to that point. I don't like Presidents who lie - including our current one who has been able to avoid most of the consequences to his lies by the collaboration of a friendly congress. But I also judge a President on more then just one action and I try to view it in context.

I don't deny Clinton has a character flaw. Ironically, some of of better presidents did, and it usually caused their fall. I'll use Nixon as an example - he was brilliant, and when it came to foreign affairs he excelled. But he had a serious character flaw.

Should I list off the number of convictions and prison sentences that came out that "wasted" money? You would have prefered that the criminials remain uncharged and working at the highest levels of government?

The investigation was taxpayer money spent on Clinton. Did Clinton get arrested or convicted or even indicted on anything? All those other convictions (and if you spend enough time on a large enough group of high profjile people you will probably uncover a number of crimes) - could they not have been done less expensively through other law enforcement agencies? How is it that all the scandals of the Bush administration were handled far less expensively and without an open-ended, multi-million dollar "special investigation"?

And do you need to be reminded that clinton was disbarred. Not for getting a bj but for comitting a crime? And considering that the evidence was overwhelming enough to get him disbarred but not convicted in congress, one must wonder if the clinton's illegal posession of 900 raw FBI files on political enemies, the families of political enemies, and those who may become political enemies had something to do with their reluctance to convict him on the overwhelming evidence.

He was disbarred for committing perjury - no more, no less. And he should have been. There was no overwelming evidence - believe me, if there was the GOP congress, and it's pet special interest groups who funded all this would have convicted him.

FBI files? Better check out a lot of Presidents if you are that naive. Including our current who legalized widespread domestic survellience that included potential leftwing enemies.

Pardon me, but I am not one to turn off my brain, and ignore facts because some congressmen tell me a thing whether I agree with them or not. They have apparently told you that vince was able to suspend the laws of physics and bypass human physiology for his suicide and you simply say OK?

Lets look at the facts.

1. It's not "some congessmen" - it's three independent investigations

2. You are looking at partial and out of context information and hearsay. Some conspiracy theorist claims were proved false - how do you know any of this is accurate if you haven't seen it first hand - and seen all of it?

3. Look at the money trail. Who and what is and has been funding all this despite evidence to the contrary as per 3 seperate independent investigations and a hostile congress eager to convict Clinton of anything.

I think you have turned off your brain to some common sense here....and I think it's because you hate Clinton so much

I will be convinced when someone addresses the facts, rather than simply telling me to ignore them and believe what they say. You apparently place much stock in those investigations, and have based your position on their findings. So tell me, how did the investigations address the following facts:

* There was no blood or tissue on the gun or foster's hand and only a trickle of blood was noted running out of his mouth by the crime scene investigators. The force of a gunshot within the mouth blows back large amounts of blood and tissue.

* Fosters fingerprints were not found on the gun in his hand. Two fingerprints were found under the grips however, and no attempt was made to identify who they belonged to. Further, the gun was made of parts of at least two guns and there is neither any evidence that the gun belonged to foster, nor any evidence that it fired the fatal shot.

* The gunpowder residue found on fosters glasses, clothing, and in his mouth did not come from the gun in his hand.

* No skull fragments were ever found at the scene of the crime even though it is stated that he had a large exit wound in the back of his skull.

How do you know these are facts?

There are others, but these will suffice for now. There are valid and very basic questions concering these facts and any competent investigation, seeking the truth would have sought to answer them. Now tell me, what were the findings of your congressional investigation regarding these facts? I will tell you what they are to save you the time it would take you to do a google search. The questions were completely ignored. They were never addressed. They became lost in the flurry of investigations.

How do you know they are valid and that they were never addressed IF they were valid?

Just one example - there was a claim that there was NO EXIT WOUND. That has been debunked.

Now, considering that these facts have never been addressed, and the obvious questions they prompt have never been answered on what basis, exactly, do you accept the story that you have apparently accepted?

And if you accept the findings from congress on these investigations considering that very important questions have not even been acknowledged, much less addressed, on what basis do you reject anything that the government tells you?

It has nothing to do with what the government does or does not tell.

I happen to think three seperate investigations funded by groups and political players hostile to Clinton should have been able to come up with something if there was something to come up with.

It's called common sense.

 

[Coyote]

Truth or fiction fed by speculation and rumor?

Ok, so you can't trust any government sources, the FBI, the police, the medical examiner - well, here's a statement from ABC.



The common thread is that Foster was murdered someplace else, that his body was moved to this park above the Potomac where it was found. And feeding all this speculation, is more speculation. For instance, the rumor that there are no photographs of the scene. There are. ABC News has seen a complete set, including this one showing Foster's hand, his thumb caught in the trigger guard. Some rumors insist there was little or no blood on or around Foster's body. The grim and graphic photographs of the scene prove that is not true either. The White House itself may have fueled some of the rumors with its own incompetence in the hours after Foster's death. But there is little reason now to doubt that for whatever reason he may have had, the President's boyhood friend drove himself across the Potomac one afternoon last July and tragically took his own life. Jim Wooten ABC News Washington

 

[Coyote]

Feel free. You will find that I don't believe 9/11 was an inside job because the facts and evidence don't support the theory just like the facts and evidence don't support suicide in the case of vince foster's death.

I wonder...do you not believe 9/11 was an inside job because you are a supporter of the current administration? And are you all to willing to believe the worst of Clinton because you despised that administration?

Be honest now...

There are many inconsistancies surrounding 9/11 - but the majority of those inconsistencies are bunk, rumor, hearsay, and misinformation. It's a bit easier to confront because there is a lot more publically available information on such a big event. But - enough inconsistencies and remain to continue fueling speculation. Much like the Vince Foster suicide. Every investigation has inconsistencies - and no one here has seen the complete report or evidence. The investigations and congress would have been privy to that. The media was privy to a great deal as well. Some people suggest that pictures of the dead body should be publically available. I can only thing how ghastly and innappropriate to the family's sensitivities that would be to see it plastered all over the internet.

People are going by distorted rumour fed by rumour fed by rumour via the internet - what ever "facts" there were are long since gone. Just like 9/11.

 

[palerider]

I wonder...do you not believe 9/11 was an inside job because you are a supporter of the current administration? And are you all to willing to believe the worst of Clinton because you despised that administration?

Be honest now...

I have said that I believe clinton had something to do with foster's death, but that was just a belief based on no particular facts. My position that foster did not commit suicide, however, is based on the evidence. The bulk of the paperwork on the investigation is available and not just the bits and pieces presented here to prove certain points. The questions I have asked are valid, and they were not addressed and until they are, then in my mind, and adequate investegation has not been performed but rather a shuck and jive designed to fog the issue to the point that nothing could be resolved.

 

[top gun]

I wonder...do you not believe 9/11 was an inside job because you are a supporter of the current administration? And are you all to willing to believe the worst of Clinton because you despised that administration?

Be honest now...

There are many inconsistancies surrounding 9/11 - but the majority of those inconsistencies are bunk, rumor, hearsay, and misinformation. It's a bit easier to confront because there is a lot more publically available information on such a big event. But - enough inconsistencies and remain to continue fueling speculation. Much like the Vince Foster suicide. Every investigation has inconsistencies - and no one here has seen the complete report or evidence. The investigations and congress would have been privy to that. The media was privy to a great deal as well. Some people suggest that pictures of the dead body should be publically available. I can only thing how ghastly and innappropriate to the family's sensitivities that would be to see it plastered all over the internet.

People are going by distorted rumour fed by rumour fed by rumour via the internet - what ever "facts" there were are long since gone. Just like 9/11.

People can really come up with some ridiculous stuff sometimes.

The Clinton's killed Vince Foster. Bush was behind the 9-11 Trade Center attack (I'm surprised anyone believes that one. Bush can't even string together a coherent sentence half the time... but still all over the Internet he's the "master" planner! ).

I tried to tell a girlfriend I stood up on night that I was abducted by aliens on the way to pick her up. I told her I was driving down this secluded street on the way to her house and all the sudden there was this blinding bright light over the car... and the next thing I knew it was 7:00 in the morning and I was in the back seat of my car along the side of the road...

Appears strippers must be pretty smart after all... smarter than a lot of people it appears... even she wouldn't fall for some far fetched, far out ridiculous story like these. As I remember we did both get a big laugh out of my alien story though.

That's what the Clinton killed Foster story is... a good laugh that a stripper could see through... for people's stupidity.

 

[Truth-Bringer]

People can really come up with some ridiculous stuff sometimes.

That's what the Clinton killed Foster story is... a good laugh that a stripper could see through... for people's stupidity.

Then why are you still here defending it, if it is so easily seen through? Why is your buddy coyote here on a non-stop rampage to defend it?

 

[Truth-Bringer]

For instance, the rumor that there are no photographs of the scene. There are. ABC News has seen a complete set, including this one showing Foster's hand, his thumb caught in the trigger guard. Some rumors insist there was little or no blood on or around Foster's body. The grim and graphic photographs of the scene prove that is not true either. The White House itself may have fueled some of the rumors with its own incompetence in the hours after Foster's death. But there is little reason now to doubt that for whatever reason he may have had, the President's boyhood friend drove himself across the Potomac one afternoon last July and tragically took his own life. Jim Wooten ABC News Washington

The point is, on the photo we can see, there's no blood where there should be lots of blood. As far as what we can't see, I'm not going to take ABC's word for it. That's just another hearsay assertion.

And as far as their claim that "that wraps it up folks" - WRONG. The fact that 3 experts - whose reports are publically available and can be questioned by any handwriting expert in the world - AND HAVE NOT BEEN ATTACKED IN ANY WAY, SHAPE, OR FORM AS BEING INACCURATE - concluded that the suicide note was forged simply does not support a suicide. If the suicide is authentic, there's no need to fake anything - the evidence will stand on its own.

 

[Truth-Bringer]

See how well all the investigations worked. After all that, you sit there thinking that it was about presidential infidelity. It was about perjury and the subject matter is completely irrelavent. If a person can decide what he will and will not tell the truth about under oath, then exactly what good is our legal system?

Should I list off the number of convictions and prison sentences that came out that "wasted" money? You would have prefered that the criminials remain uncharged and working at the highest levels of government?

And do you need to be reminded that clinton was disbarred. Not for getting a bj but for comitting a crime?

Good points. Let's look at the criminality of those within Clinton's administration and those he "did business with":

List 6: Criminals: All these people have served prison sentences for illegal activity in a Clinton scandal. They either were convicted or pled guilty. There are over 15 convictions/guilty pleas from Starr's investigation plus several others from other scandal investigations.

# Whitewater:

* AK Gov. Jim Guy Tucker - fraud felony convictions - 3 counts (Tucker resigned facing impeachment)
* Jim McDougal - fraud and conspiracy felony convictions - 18 counts
* Susan McDougal - felony - 4 counts (pardoned during Clinton's last minute pardongate payoffs)
* William J. Marks Sr - conspiracy
* Stephen Smith - conspiracy
* Larry Kuca - Fraud
* Neal Ainley - 2 misdemeanors for embezzlement
* David Hale - guilty plea - conspiracy
* Chris Wade - felony - Whitewater real-estate investor
* John Haley - recent! 1998 on fraud
* Robert Palmer - felony for conspiracy
* Charles Matthews - guilty plea for bribery
* Eugene Fitzhugh - Whitewater - bribery
* Webster Hubbell - #2 ranking Justice Dept. Official - felony for embezzlement and fraud
* John Latham - CEO of Madison Bank - bank fraud

# Campaign Finance:

* Johnny Chung - Clinton cronie - felony guilty plea - funneling money from China
* Gene Lum - convicted - felony for money laundering for the DNC
* Nora Lum - convicted - felony for money laundering for the DNC
* Howard Glicken - guilty plea - 2 midemeanors - funneling foreign donations
* Yah Lin "Charlie" Trie - guilty plea - illegal Clinton campaign donations
* John Huang - Clinton cronie - felony guilty plea - funneling money from China

# Paula Jonesgate:

# William Jefferson Clinton - found guilty - civil contempt of court - lying under oath about material facts. The Office of the Independent Council further presented Clinton with an agreement that had him disbarred from practicing law for 5 years and made him signed statement admitting to his deception

 

[Truth-Bringer]

There's no need for the video to have existed. Why was he beaten after he publically announced he had a video tape of Clinton leaving Gennifer Flowers' apartment by people he'd never seen before? Why was the crime unsolved? Why was no one ever arrested? Why was no other motive ever investigated?

You guys ever going to address these questions?

 

[Popeye]

Good points. Let's look at the criminality of those within Clinton's administration and those he "did business with":

List 6: Criminals: All these people have served prison sentences for illegal activity in a Clinton scandal. They either were convicted or pled guilty. There are over 15 convictions/guilty pleas from Starr's investigation plus several others from other scandal investigations.

# Whitewater:

* AK Gov. Jim Guy Tucker - fraud felony convictions - 3 counts (Tucker resigned facing impeachment)
* Jim McDougal - fraud and conspiracy felony convictions - 18 counts
* Susan McDougal - felony - 4 counts (pardoned during Clinton's last minute pardongate payoffs)
* William J. Marks Sr - conspiracy
* Stephen Smith - conspiracy
* Larry Kuca - Fraud
* Neal Ainley - 2 misdemeanors for embezzlement
* David Hale - guilty plea - conspiracy
* Chris Wade - felony - Whitewater real-estate investor
* John Haley - recent! 1998 on fraud
* Robert Palmer - felony for conspiracy
* Charles Matthews - guilty plea for bribery
* Eugene Fitzhugh - Whitewater - bribery
* Webster Hubbell - #2 ranking Justice Dept. Official - felony for embezzlement and fraud
* John Latham - CEO of Madison Bank - bank fraud

# Campaign Finance:

* Johnny Chung - Clinton cronie - felony guilty plea - funneling money from China
* Gene Lum - convicted - felony for money laundering for the DNC
* Nora Lum - convicted - felony for money laundering for the DNC
* Howard Glicken - guilty plea - 2 midemeanors - funneling foreign donations
* Yah Lin "Charlie" Trie - guilty plea - illegal Clinton campaign donations
* John Huang - Clinton cronie - felony guilty plea - funneling money from China

# Paula Jonesgate:

# William Jefferson Clinton - found guilty - civil contempt of court - lying under oath about material facts. The Office of the Independent Council further presented Clinton with an agreement that had him disbarred from practicing law for 5 years and made him signed statement admitting to his deception

What's the point? Both parties are awash in campaign finance irregularities. It doesn't further your case for Vince Foster being murdered.

Admit it now, you just are one of those people who can't resist conspiracy theories. As I understand, it's classified as an actual addiction. No harm done, one day you might actually be right, just not today.