Religions are fairy tales for adults. Should we encourage them to grow up?

[remnant]

Am at a loss because you first dismiss Allah and God and then go on to advocate for original forms of worship. My fifty cents worth of advice is that religion is a personal issue that in the fulness of time everyone will have to reckon his or her day with the Creator. God doesn't change so religion should not change to accommodate such aberrations as gayism. One person said it is better to believe and find it is a hoax, than to disbelieve and find it is true after death.

 

[Gnostic Christian Bishop]

I'm not sure if I'd go as far as to say that's all they want to do, but I do think that a lot of them do rule with fear rather than common sense and reasoning.

Indeed.

Religions are often preaching against using logic and reason.

Martin Luther.
“Faith must trample under foot all reason, sense, and understanding.”
“Reason is a whore, the greatest enemy that faith has.”

And a bit more modern.

http://imgur.com/IBroXK9

Regards
DL

 

[Gnostic Christian Bishop]

While I'm not a fan or avid follower of religion, isn't hell supposed to be run by the devil? I'm guessing God wouldn't have any jurisdiction on how he runs that place...I've just read that back and realised just how ridiculous that sounds to myself by the way, so I'm not sure how religions have got other people to fall for it!

The carrot and stick thinking has always, till recently, been the method used for control of children.

Wait till your father gets home was the order of the day when I grew up.

The churches and mosques are basically treating adults like children and the adults live with it because they are conditioned and brainwashed from childhood.

Most have moved away from corporeal punishment and mostly only the fundamental and literalist are now use force against children.

Regards
DL

 

[Gnostic Christian Bishop]

I'm not sure if most of what your saying is Biblical, or just popular myth. Actually, it is true that God has power over Hell, hence why many would blame him for the endless torture and whatnot that goes on there. Also, it is stated in Revelations, Satan, himself, will be punished eventually.

Is justice delayed justice denied? I think so.

It is like God allowing a rapist to just keep raping while saying, wait I will punish you after you rape a few more.

If you analyse Christian theology, it become clear that it is mostly an immoral creed.

Regards
DL

 

[Gnostic Christian Bishop]

Am at a loss because you first dismiss Allah and God and then go on to advocate for original forms of worship. My fifty cents worth of advice is that religion is a personal issue that in the fulness of time everyone will have to reckon his or her day with the Creator. God doesn't change so religion should not change to accommodate such aberrations as gayism. One person said it is better to believe and find it is a hoax, than to disbelieve and find it is true after death.

I do not advocate any type of hypocrisy and think a God would be able to recognize it. Strange that you do not.

As to gays, why do you think God creates them?

Just for you to hate and deny a loving relationship to?

What's it to you what consenting adults do with their junk?

What give you the right to negatively effect them and deny them a life long marriage?

Why do you discriminate without a just cause?

Regards
DL

 

[Gnostic Christian Bishop]

Am at a loss because you first dismiss Allah and God and then go on to advocate for original forms of worship. .

??

I do not recall advocating the worship of any of the imaginary Gods?
Seeking God perhaps, but not worship.

Perhaps it was my writing style. Get the offensive quote please so as I might see how I erred and gave you that false impression.

Regards
DL

 

[AugustineJurnior]

Religions are fairy tales for adults. Should we encourage them to grow up?


My mind set is close to Daniel Dennett as far as what religious people / theist should become after they grow up.


Personally, I like a lot of the social functions and appeasement of our need for fellowship, hivishness and tribalism offered by religious institutions.

So I do not want to kill all religions but just encourage them to be more moral, tolerant and give equality to women and gays.


Having said the above, People and recent trends to read scriptures literally have cause many to forget that religions were invented as theatre and myth and were never meant to be read or taken literally. They were designed to seek God, not to find one.


http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/03132009/watch.html


Rabbi Hillel, the older contemporary of Jesus, said that when asked to sum up the whole of Jewish teaching, while he stood on one leg, said, "The Golden Rule. That which is hateful to you, do not do to your neighbor. That is the Torah. And everything else is only commentary. Now, go and study it."


Please listen as to what is said about literal reading.


"Origen, the great second or third century Greek commentator on the Bible said that it is absolutely impossible to take these texts literally. You simply cannot do so. And he said, "God has put these sort of conundrums and paradoxes in so that we are forced to seek a deeper meaning."


As you can see from the following, religions and temples have always been about entertainment and fellowship.

If Christianity and Islam could return to the old way of seeking God instead of idol worshiping false Gods, perhaps jihadists and other fundamental believers might chill and get along the way they have at some points in our past history.


Religions are fairy tales for adults. If this is a truth, we should encourage Christianity and Islam as well as all other religions to grow up and return to their better past of seeking God instead of idol worshiping Yahweh and Allah. Both of them are mythical and manmade Gods.


Regards

DL

You sound ignorant. I read this and thought "what an uneducated clod" and you have ORigen ALL WRONG...as Augustine said and Gregory the Great

===>
Augustine believes that it is the ambiguity of figurative words that causes the most difficulty. He says a primary error in exegesis is to take a figurative expression literally (DDC III:9:13). He notes that this is what Paul warns us about when he says, “The letter kills, but the Spirit gives life” (2 Cor. 3:6)
=====>

“Scripture is like a river . . . broad and deep, shallow enough here for the lamb to go wading, but deep enough there for the elephant to swim.” Gregory the Great​

Your error is childish you say 3 things that CANNOT be true
1) that the faith and Scriptural understanding of the newly converted young person must match that of the expert

2) That everything in Scriptukre must resolve into one De Fide meaning. Absurd

3) That Cicero, Socrates, Plato, Aristotle, Augustine, Aquines are wrong about religion for the 2 reasons you adduce: Intelligence ! and honesty

THis is all patent nonsense and I post it for the readers to know that I see clearly what is wrong with you

 

[AugustineJurnior]

I do not advocate any type of hypocrisy and think a God would be able to recognize it. Strange that you do not.

As to gays, why do you think God creates them?

Just for you to hate and deny a loving relationship to?

What's it to you what consenting adults do with their junk?

What give you the right to negatively effect them and deny them a life long marriage?

Why do you discriminate without a just cause?

Regards
DL

You make 3 errors that you are obviously unaware of.
Gays can't sin through sexual immorality and lust , only non-gays. Pure nonsense that you think that.
Consenting never removes the guilt of a sin , it increases it. "Though they know God’s righteous decree that those who practice such things deserve to die, they not only do them but give approval to those who practice them."
The just cause is societal not just individual. Whatever it is it can't be marraige, It is unnatural , perverted, and societally harmful. The gayest civilizaiton ever also denied marriage to the act because it was disgusting. the Greeks and Romans had no moral disapproval of homosexual relations, yet neither culture ever considered approving same-sex marriage.

Let Socrates have the last word :
when at Gorgias 491e-492a Callicles argues in favor of indulging passions regardless of conventions, Socrates inquires whether a man who has an itch and wants to scratch, and may scratch in all freedom, can pass his life happily in continual scratching: καὶ πρῶτον μὲν εἰπὲ εἰ καὶ ψωρῶντα καὶ κνησιῶντα, ἀφθόνως ἔχοντα τοῦ κνῆσθαι, κνώμενον διατελοῦντα τὸν βίον εὐδαιμόνως ἔστι ζῆν. (494c). After Callicles avers that the man who scratches himself will thus spend his life sweetly (ἡδέως) and happily (εὐδαιμόνως), Socrates inquires whether the same licence applies to the life of a catamite (κίναιδος). Is not that awful, shameful, and wretched (δεινὸς καὶ αἰσχρὸς καὶ ἄθλιος)? Or will Callicles dare (τολμάω) to assert that such men are happy if they can freely indulge their wants? Whereupon a shocked Callicles inquires whether Socrates is not ashamed (αἰσχῡνῃ) to lead the discussion into such topics (494e). But Socrates responds by locating the object of shame in the person who says outright that those who enjoy themselves with whatever kind of enjoyment, are happy, and draws no distinction between the good and bad sorts of pleasure (495a).

YES, REASON SHOWS HOMOSEXUAL ACTS TO BE WRONG

 

[AugustineJurnior]

Well, people indoctrinate their children with all sorts of things, including anti-religious dogma. Schools indoctrinate children with all kinds of garbage too. So, I guess we shouldn't wave pitchforks at people for taking their kids to Sunday School. If it's cult-like (or hate group stuff) then yeah, there are concerns.

Again, totally against the actual science and history.


Developmental psychologists have provided evidence that children are naturally tuned to believe in gods of one sort or another.

Children tend to see natural objects as designed or purposeful in ways that go beyond what their parents teach, as Deborah Kelemen has demonstrated. Rivers exist so that we can go fishing on them, and birds are here to look pretty.

Children doubt that impersonal processes can create order or purpose. Studies with children show that they expect that someone not something is behind natural order. No wonder that Margaret Evans found that children younger than 10 favoured creationist accounts of the origins of animals over evolutionary accounts even when their parents and teachers endorsed evolution. Authorities' testimony didn't carry enough weight to over-ride a natural tendency.

Children know humans are not behind the order so the idea of a creating god (or gods) makes sense to them. Children just need adults to specify which one.

Experimental evidence, including cross-cultural studies, suggests that three-year-olds attribute super, god-like qualities to lots of different beings. Super-power, super-knowledge and super-perception seem to be default assumptions. Children then have to learn that mother is fallible, and dad is not all powerful, and that people will die. So children may be particularly receptive to the idea of a super creator-god. It fits their predilections.

Recent research by Paul Bloom, Jesse Bering, and Emma Cohen suggests that children may also be predisposed to believe in a soul that persists beyond death.

 

[AugustineJurnior]

Stuff being forced on children is always a problem with libertarian thinking. Sure, I think people should be free to do what they want, as long as they don't hurt others. However, it's very easy to force things on impressionable children. Even in my own family, I think certain family members allow small children to watch Freddy Kruger movies, simply cause they have no standards.

As a final note, a lot of kids have been exposed to games like Grand Theft Auto. However, the values taught on the game are horrible. A kid learns stealing, profanity, and violence. Nonetheless, among certain macho subcultures, exposing that to kids isn't a big deal, along with secondhand smoke. Ultimately, if the parent has no values, chances are, he will force such a way of thinking on his offspring.

Anyhow, here is another question, "Is religious indoctrination necessary to keep people from forcing a trashy lifestyle on thier offspring?".

You consistently misrepresent even your own position !!!!

Developmental psychologists have provided evidence that children are naturally tuned to believe in gods of one sort or another.

Children tend to see natural objects as designed or purposeful in ways that go beyond what their parents teach, as Deborah Kelemen has demonstrated. Rivers exist so that we can go fishing on them, and birds are here to look pretty.

Children doubt that impersonal processes can create order or purpose. Studies with children show that they expect that someone not something is behind natural order. No wonder that Margaret Evans found that children younger than 10 favoured creationist accounts of the origins of animals over evolutionary accounts even when their parents and teachers endorsed evolution. Authorities' testimony didn't carry enough weight to over-ride a natural tendency.

Children know humans are not behind the order so the idea of a creating god (or gods) makes sense to them. Children just need adults to specify which one.

Experimental evidence, including cross-cultural studies, suggests that three-year-olds attribute super, god-like qualities to lots of different beings. Super-power, super-knowledge and super-perception seem to be default assumptions. Children then have to learn that mother is fallible, and dad is not all powerful, and that people will die. So children may be particularly receptive to the idea of a super creator-god. It fits their predilections.

Recent research by Paul Bloom, Jesse Bering, and Emma Cohen suggests that children may also be predisposed to believe in a soul that persists beyond death.

======================== SO juist 3 howlers in your poor logic

YOu deny logic, first principles, natural theology and conscience. That a child thinks as he does cannot be for the magic reasons you give.

Natural Religion as it occurred in Rome and Greece was purely REASON


Even in your own life, do you hold the equality of all people as something up in the air and await evidence that will allow you to deny it.
I get you don't.

And I can tell you've never taken a science course. I've probably taken 10 at the mainly pre-med level with labs and this is true as can be though you non-science types are always surprised by it.

The amount of knowledge which we can justify from evidence directly available to us can never be large. The overwhelming proportion of our factual beliefs continue therefore to be held at second hand through trusting others, and in the great majority of cases our trust is placed in the authority of comparatively few people of widely acknowledged standing.

Michael Polanyi

 

[AugustineJurnior]

Funny you should say that. My grandmother used to go to church on a Sunday as she got older, I'm guessing she thought if there was one, then when you get into your 80's, now is the time to try and get on the right side of him!

My grandfather always said though she's just gone for a singsong and to listen to a few stories, looking back he was probably right!

That was never true until partly modern times. Even in colonial times, a service could last two hours with plenty of Scripture and a sermon touching on philosophy public affairs and apologetics.

Virtually all the schools that are now Ivy League were seminaries and many of the Founders had extensive exposure to religious philosophy and exegesis in classical languages.

 

[Gnostic Christian Bishop]

I see clearly what is wrong with you

Good. Now try to communicate like an adult.

 

[mark francis]

Religions are fairy tales for adults. Should we encourage them to grow up?


My mind set is close to Daniel Dennett as far as what religious people / theist should become after they grow up.


Personally, I like a lot of the social functions and appeasement of our need for fellowship, hivishness and tribalism offered by religious institutions.

So I do not want to kill all religions but just encourage them to be more moral, tolerant and give equality to women and gays.


Having said the above, People and recent trends to read scriptures literally have cause many to forget that religions were invented as theatre and myth and were never meant to be read or taken literally. They were designed to seek God, not to find one.


http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/03132009/watch.html


Rabbi Hillel, the older contemporary of Jesus, said that when asked to sum up the whole of Jewish teaching, while he stood on one leg, said, "The Golden Rule. That which is hateful to you, do not do to your neighbor. That is the Torah. And everything else is only commentary. Now, go and study it."


Please listen as to what is said about literal reading.


"Origen, the great second or third century Greek commentator on the Bible said that it is absolutely impossible to take these texts literally. You simply cannot do so. And he said, "God has put these sort of conundrums and paradoxes in so that we are forced to seek a deeper meaning."


As you can see from the following, religions and temples have always been about entertainment and fellowship.

If Christianity and Islam could return to the old way of seeking God instead of idol worshiping false Gods, perhaps jihadists and other fundamental believers might chill and get along the way they have at some points in our past history.


Religions are fairy tales for adults. If this is a truth, we should encourage Christianity and Islam as well as all other religions to grow up and return to their better past of seeking God instead of idol worshiping Yahweh and Allah. Both of them are mythical and manmade Gods.


Regards

DL

I suppose we should allow atheists to believe and promote lies to support their religious addictions to myths.

 

[Gnostic Christian Bishop]

those who practice such things deserve to die,

That is quite unjust thinking and shows why you adore a genocidal LGBT+ hating prick of a God..

Did you not know that the standard of justice is an eye for an eye. That is reciprocity to the educated.

I am not surprised that you have such a poor sense of justice and contradict your own bible.

 

[mark francis]

That is quite unjust thinking and shows why you adore a genocidal LGBT+ hating prick of a God..

Did you not know that the standard of justice is an eye for an eye. That is reciprocity to the educated.

I am not surprised that you have such a poor sense of justice and contradict your own bible.

Blaspheming the Creater God is an extremely stupid thing to do.