Obama: "Back to 1967 borders." Netanyahu: "Indefensible. Not going to happen."

O MY GOD! OBAMA state what has basicly been US policy for years! O my god! He said Israel should have a border...based on...its created Border...the horror!

The Obama white house has said that it is not a departure from previous policy but the Obama White House is not exactly honest:



“It is clear, however, that a return to the situation of 4 June 1967 will not bring peace. There must be secure and there must be recognized borders.”

— President Lyndon Johnson, September 1968

“In the pre-1967 borders, Israel was barely ten miles wide at its narrowest point. The bulk of Israel’s population lived within artillery range of hostile armies. I am not about to ask Israel to live that way again.”

— President Ronald Reagan, September 1, 1982

“Israel will never negotiate from or return to the 1967 borders.”

— Secretary of State George Shultz, September 1988

“I think there can be no genuine resolution to the conflict without a sovereign, viable, Palestinian state that accommodates Israeli’s security requirements and the demographic realities. That suggests Palestinian sovereignty over Gaza, the vast majority of the West Bank, the incorporation into Israel of settlement blocks … To make the agreement durable, I think there will have to be some territorial swaps and other arrangements.”

— President Bill Clinton, January 7, 2001

“Ultimately, Israelis and Palestinians must address the core issues that divide them if there is to be a real peace, resolving all claims and ending the conflict between them. This means that the Israeli occupation that began in 1967 will be ended through a settlement negotiated between the parties, based on UN resolutions 242 and 338, with Israeli withdrawal to secure and recognize borders.”

— President George W. Bush, June 24, 2002
 
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“I think there can be no genuine resolution to the conflict without a sovereign, viable, Palestinian state that accommodates Israeli’s security requirements and the demographic realities. That suggests Palestinian sovereignty over Gaza, the vast majority of the West Bank, the incorporation into Israel of settlement blocks … To make the agreement durable, I think there will have to be some territorial swaps and other arrangements.”

— President Bill Clinton, January 7, 2001

“Ultimately, Israelis and Palestinians must address the core issues that divide them if there is to be a real peace, resolving all claims and ending the conflict between them. This means that the Israeli occupation that began in 1967 will be ended through a settlement negotiated between the parties, based on UN resolutions 242 and 338, with Israeli withdrawal to secure and recognize borders.”

— President George W. Bush, June 24, 2002

Wow, it looks to me like Clinton and Bush stated the same thing that Obama just stated the other day. "Swaps" and "Israeli withdrawal" were part of Obama's statement, too.

All three of them, Clinton and Bush and Obama, are out of their minds if they believe that Israel is going to withdraw to their pre-1967 borders.
 
Wow, it looks to me like Clinton and Bush stated the same thing that Obama just stated the other day. "Swaps" and "Israeli withdrawal" were part of Obama's statement, too.

All three of them, Clinton and Bush and Obama, are out of their minds if they believe that Israel is going to withdraw to their pre-1967 borders.

Obama's statement said more than Clinton's and Bush's - they asked for land swaps but Obama said they needed to be based on the 1967 borders.

Personally I think Israel would be safe to agree to such a thing since the surrounding states will never agree to respect Israels right to exist and such a deal would never be made in the first place.
 
God am I sick of all this BS from Israel. They are a hugely powerful state, yet they continue to whine about Palestine. What is an "indefensible border?" That is what the UN gave them in 1947... a year after I was born. And they are still complaining today.

They are complaining about a war that happened in 1967 when I was in college! NOW I AM RETIRED!

Why is Netanyahyu still yammering in front of Congress to thunderous applause? Since 1967 Vietnam has changed from a nation at war to a very popular, prosperous tourist destination. The Soviet Union has vanished.

Yet we are still hearing the same old moaning and groaning from the Jews. We set them up as a strong, independent nation in 1947. As a country and citizens of the US, Israel is hugely powerful, complete with a nuclear arsenal!

Israel, we don't need to hear your problems. Go home and take care of your own problems, by yourself. I don't want to give you $3 billion each year and then hear the same old sob story I have been hearing since I was a young kid.

Go home and don't bother us.
 
God am I sick of all this BS from Israel. They are a hugely powerful state, yet they continue to whine about Palestine. What is an "indefensible border?" That is what the UN gave them in 1947... a year after I was born. And they are still complaining today.

They are complaining about a war that happened in 1967 when I was in college! NOW I AM RETIRED!

Why is Netanyahyu still yammering in front of Congress to thunderous applause? Since 1967 Vietnam has changed from a nation at war to a very popular, prosperous tourist destination. The Soviet Union has vanished.

Yet we are still hearing the same old moaning and groaning from the Jews. We set them up as a strong, independent nation in 1947. As a country and citizens of the US, Israel is hugely powerful, complete with a nuclear arsenal!

Israel, we don't need to hear your problems. Go home and take care of your own problems, by yourself. I don't want to give you $3 billion each year and then hear the same old sob story I have been hearing since I was a young kid.

Go home and don't bother us.

I'd like to believe that you are kidding around and being sarcastic, but I don't think you are. Are you?
 
I'd like to believe that you are kidding around and being sarcastic, but I don't think you are. Are you?

No, I sincerely feel that way. I think Obama tried to say, "Peace is necessary, and Israel is in a position to make it happen". Defensible borders? Put in a few Patriot missile defense installations (or something similar), and stop any rockets. Set up some Tomahawk missles to keep any Arab out of some demilitarized zone. Why is a border 20 miles wide more defensive than 8 miles wide?

Everybody was happy when Hamas and Fatah come together for a unified statehood push. Now Hamas is a big problem towards negotiations.

1967 borders as a basis for negotiations? Hey, you've got to start somewhere. Netanyahu can't say Obama fouled up the whole peace process by talking 1967.

Listen. This fight between Israel and Palestine is keeping the terrorist pot boiling. Obama is right to say, "find a way to peace". Nothing is impossible. Let's stop being so protective of Israel and say, "Hey, time for you guys to settle this issue". Nothing is impossible. Do it!
 
No, I sincerely feel that way. I think Obama tried to say, "Peace is necessary, and Israel is in a position to make it happen". Defensible borders? Put in a few Patriot missile defense installations (or something similar), and stop any rockets. Set up some Tomahawk missles to keep any Arab out of some demilitarized zone. Why is a border 20 miles wide more defensive than 8 miles wide?

Everybody was happy when Hamas and Fatah come together for a unified statehood push. Now Hamas is a big problem towards negotiations.

1967 borders as a basis for negotiations? Hey, you've got to start somewhere. Netanyahu can't say Obama fouled up the whole peace process by talking 1967.

Listen. This fight between Israel and Palestine is keeping the terrorist pot boiling. Obama is right to say, "find a way to peace". Nothing is impossible. Let's stop being so protective of Israel and say, "Hey, time for you guys to settle this issue". Nothing is impossible. Do it!

You are aware that the Palestinian Authority and Hamas are one in the same, aren't you?

Do you really believe that terrorist organizations are interested in good-faith negotiations with a country (Israel) that they refuse to acknowledge the existence of, and have stated many times that they plan on wiping off the face of the earth?

Do you really expect Israel to enter into good-faith negotiations with terrorist organizations?

Do you even realize that you are putting all of the pressure on Israel to "settle the issue", when it was Israel who was attacked in 1967 and it was Israel that fought off the aggressors and captured additional territory that provides more protection for their citizens?

Every middle eastern war involving Israel has been the same......Israel being attacked by other middle eastern countries.....yet you believe that Israel should still be the one country that surrenders it's own safety, and sovereignty, to their sworn enemies.

Your assertions and expectations are beyond wrongheaded. They are just SILLY.
 
There comes a time in all conflicts when enough suffering and enough dying finally bring the waring parties to bargaining table.

We cannot look back and label any group as "eternally terrorist". After the raids I have seen Israel make into Gaza, the term terrorist sees fitting for Israel as well. It is time for the dying to stop.

I am not asking Israel to give up its security. The truth is Israel is located in a dangerous area. However, something like a demilitarized zone and modern weaponry can go a long way to provide security.

In truth, if Palestine and Israel can come to a true peace agreement, both independent States will be a whole lot safer.

It is time to put away the fiery verbiage and for both parties to sit down and find a way to live together. And the US has every right to expect that now is the time.
 
“Barack Obama won the Jewish vote by 57 points – 78 to 21,” Pat Buchanan explained. “That is enormous. That is about as high as it gets. What you’re going to get now I think because what Netanyahu did to him – basically dissed him right in the oval office, that he’s putting Israel at risk – I think that this, frankly this could cost Obama Florida and it’s certainly going to cost the Democratic Party a tremendous amount of money.” Pat Buchanan
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2011/05/24/buchanan_obamas_israel_policy_cost_him_the_jewish_vote_florida_in_2012.html

If he is right, BO loses in 2012. Without Florida, he likely can't win.

Anybody but BO '12
 
There comes a time in all conflicts when enough suffering and enough dying finally bring the waring parties to bargaining table.

We cannot look back and label any group as "eternally terrorist". After the raids I have seen Israel make into Gaza, the term terrorist sees fitting for Israel as well. It is time for the dying to stop.

Bullshiit. After Hamas sent 6000 rockets into israel, hitting such as day care centers, they got tired of it and gave it back to them. If it's time to stop dying, tell it to Hamas.

I am not asking Israel to give up its security. The truth is Israel is located in a dangerous area. However, something like a demilitarized zone and modern weaponry can go a long way to provide security.

Absurd - the islamofascists use missiles - how can that be stopped by a demilitarized zone??

It is time to put away the fiery verbiage and for both parties to sit down and find a way to live together. And the US has every right to expect that now is the time.

Your naivete borders on childishness - they've "sat down" for 60 years, and nothing has ever come of it. With a total amateur in the whitehouse, certainly nothing will come of it now.
 
No, I sincerely feel that way. I think Obama tried to say, "Peace is necessary, and Israel is in a position to make it happen". Defensible borders? Put in a few Patriot missile defense installations (or something similar), and stop any rockets. Set up some Tomahawk missles to keep any Arab out of some demilitarized zone. Why is a border 20 miles wide more defensive than 8 miles wide?

This is one of the most absurd statements I have ever heard....

"Put in a few Patriot missile defense installations"....you are aware that the primary role of the Patriot missile defense system is an anti-ballistic missile system, with a limited capacity for stopping rockets.

Additionally, the cost of using a system like Patriot to stop rocket attacks is simply not feasible....hence the Israeli deployment of the Iron Dome (which uses the Tamir interceptor).

Not to mention the problem that you basically are proposing defending a border (badly) against a conventional army...which the Palestinians are not.

Everybody was happy when Hamas and Fatah come together for a unified statehood push. Now Hamas is a big problem towards negotiations.

1967 borders as a basis for negotiations? Hey, you've got to start somewhere. Netanyahu can't say Obama fouled up the whole peace process by talking 1967.

Listen. This fight between Israel and Palestine is keeping the terrorist pot boiling. Obama is right to say, "find a way to peace". Nothing is impossible. Let's stop being so protective of Israel and say, "Hey, time for you guys to settle this issue". Nothing is impossible. Do it!

Certainly we want peace in Israel, but you severely underestimate the feelings that run deep within the region...Obama saying "work it out" is basically meaningless.
 
Well, you all can make your pleas to keep the status quo. I, for one, am sick of the whole mess. If the Israeli's want to just "kick the can down the road" - then they can do it by themselves. I see no reason for the US to give money and moral support behind any party in this fight.

It has gone on too long and killed too many people. If Hamas and the terrorists in the region are truly so threatening, then let Israel declare war and run all the Arabs out of the Gaza strip and annex the all of the "occupied lands" into Israeli territory. Then, and only then, will Israel truly have defensible borders.

If Hamas is truly an arm of Iran, then Israel has every right to do what George Bush did in Iraq... invade the country and take control.

The only thing I want is for the US to divorce itself from this mess where the Jews and the Muslims seem to enjoy the battle.

In this era of Arab spring, the US needs to be recognized as a neutral, independent country - ready and willing to help any country truly seeking to implement democracy. As long as we are Israel's closest ally, we will continue to be regarded as enemies of the Arabs.

Now that Osama bin Laden is gone, the US can now take the high ground and seek the respect and trust of all nations. I see no reason whatsoever why we must be Israel's babysitter.
 
Why should the US be a neutral country in this? The amount of money is a tiny drop in the bucket compared even to obozo's post election payoffs with treasury money to the US liberal establishment. Israel, one of the two democracies in the middle east, is facing the same sort of islamofascist mass murderers that attacked the US on 9-11. We need to continue to make common cause. And one jewish Holocaust is enough.
 
Why should the US be a neutral country in this? The amount of money is a tiny drop in the bucket compared even to obozo's post election payoffs with treasury money to the US liberal establishment. Israel, one of the two democracies in the middle east, is facing the same sort of islamofascist mass murderers that attacked the US on 9-11. We need to continue to make common cause. And one jewish Holocaust is enough.

Here is a quote from Wikipedia, under Osama bin Laden:
"According to former CIA analyst Michael Scheuer, ...the al-Qaeda leader was motivated by a belief that U.S. foreign policy has oppressed, killed, or otherwise harmed Muslims in the Middle East."

In other words "Muslims hate us for what we do, not who we are."​

Now I recognize that bin Ladin also had fanatical Islamic beliefs, but I think that is fairly unique in the Muslim world. Most Muslims do not want to be ruled by autocrats or theocrats. We are seeing evidence of the revolt against theocracy in Iran.

But if you can shake your head free of all-American ideology and just take a look at the world, you can see that the US has its military claws in almost every region of the world. Look at the countries colored dark blue - indicating major military presence.
800px-US_military_bases_in_the_world_2007.svg.png

If you look at the Middle East, the US presence is obvious. Now you and I know the history of why our military is in each of those countries. But Omar the Tent-maker is less concerned about abstract foreign politics, and more concerned wondering if bombs are going to start falling in his country like they did in Libya recently.

It is guys like Omar I want to convince that the US is a nation of peace, not war. To do that we need to take action to become more neutral and less threatening on a mass military scale. Lets make the map of the Middle East look less blue - like South America. We need to show Muslims around the world that the US killed bin Laden and did major damage to al-Qaeda. Now we can get out our soldiers, our ships, and our airplanes out of the Middle East. We can put some distance between ourselves and Israel.

We can leave behind a smaller, covert force to deal with the "Islamofascist mass murderers that attacked the US on 9-11."

However, our goal should be to bring peace to the Middle East - at least in so far as US involvement is concerned. Let things settle down and the terrorist organizations will find far fewer recruits to die as martyrs. Plus, you give a chance for the voices of moderate secular organizations in places like Egypt to be heard. Right now the voices of the Muslim Brotherhood resonate because the US military, and Israel are standing right on their borders.

That's why I say, we fought the good war. Now is a time for peace. We have the most advanced military hardware in the world, and are happy to give weapons to Israel. They should be able to find some security from the fact they have nuclear weapons, the finest army and the most advanced weaponry in the world. We have other political goal to achieve other than keeping Israel safe - they can do that themselves now.

Now is the time we assume the role of Gentle Giant... you know, speak softly but carry a big stick. Maybe my kids can finish out their lives in a country where they don't get strip searched every time they board an airplane! This could be the beginning of the end of the "war on terrorism".
 
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So you "had" a Jewish wife? The key word is "had".

That's right.

She died from complications received in the 1983 Harrods bombing by the IRA in London.

At the time, the IRA was actively funded by Irish Americans.

How far do you want to take this ?

Comrade Stalin
 
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