Is Gaza Really an "Occupied" Territory

[Texas_tea]

You should see the television programming and school lessons for the poor Palestinian children. They are brainwashed as babies to hate and want to murder Jews.

Sad they can't see how they are used as tools for Iran and the Muslim Brotherhood. The Hamas and their terrorist blood thirsty supporters will continue to use and abuse them.

Yes, this is true.

I have commented before that the Palestinians will continue to suffer at the hands of these islamist until they themselves evolve enough as a people to see who the real enemy is.

 

[Aus22]

Both sides are brainwash, Even Israeli children.

 

[Iolo2]

You should see the television programming and school lessons for the poor Palestinian children. They are brainwashed as babies to hate and want to murder Jews.

Sad they can't see how they are used as tools for Iran and the Muslim Brotherhood. The Hamas and their terrorist blood thirsty supporters will continue to use and abuse them.

Like French or Yugoslav children in the War, who hated being murdered by Nazi scumbags, doubtless. How DO you creatures even look in a mirror, covered in blood as you are?

 

[Centrehalf]

With what is taking place in Gaza I keep seeing the usual statements of Israel invading "occupied Gaza". But is Gaza really an occupied territory? The next time you hear someone make this statement, ask them why they think Gaza is "occupied". After all, Israel essentially completely withdrew in 2005.

If the person making the claim can muster an answer at all (which I have found to be unlikely in personal conversations) you will hear the usual talk that even though Israel has withdrawn from Gaza they continue to exercise complete control over airspace, the borders (ignoring that Egypt controls the Rafah Crossing), and have instituted a "blockade" essentially from land and sea - thus creating an "occupation" under international law.

But what international law? What is this claim even based on? Article 42 of the 1907 Hague Regulations? No. The Geneva Conventions maybe? Nope. Far as I can tell it is based on nothing meaningful. To make this argument and assert it amounts to an "occupation" of Gaza, one must view the blockade of Cuba as the United States "occupying" Cuba during the Cuban Missile Crisis. One must essentially view border controls as an "occupation", because you control who is able to cross your border. It just doesn't make any sense.

Even more laughably one might look to the recent UNSC Resolution in regards to action in Libya and see how an "occupation" was defined - for a glaring example of the double standard the Anti-Israeli types want to employ. It authorized military force, froze assets, created a no-fly zone over Libya, yet specifically rules out "occupation". Based on claims from those arguing Gaza is occupied for this reason, that is the very definition of an occupation - but it is clearly not the case.

Pro-Hamas types like to blame Israel for everything bad taking place in Gaza, so let us back up to see just how Hamas has run Gaza into the ground and attempted to blame Israel for their own actions. In 2005 Israel left Gaza and at the time Israeli PM Sharon stated, “We desire a life living side-by-side, in understanding and peace. Our goal [in disengaging] is that the Palestinians will be able to live in dignity and freedom in an independent state, and, together with us, enjoy good neighborly relations.” You might recall that Hamas (not the main power in Gaza at the time) reacted by calling for more Jihad against Israel.

Despite this, Israel and the Palestinian Authority signed the Agreement on Movement and Access which gave Palestinians control over their borders, allowed imports and exports, and included construction of a seaport and possible airport. Unfortunately Hamas rose to power and purged Gaza of their Fatah rivals and declared that Gaza would be a base to destroy Israel.

After this, Israel responded in 2007 with a blockade (which a 2011 UN inquiry found to be legal by the way) to keep weapons out of the hands of Hamas, while letting through humanitarian items and food. Hamas negated all of the previous agreements in Gaza which would have been clearly beneficial to the people living there - and for what? Essentially for the ability to attack Israel.

Even now, they continue to reject the Egyptian truce deal, which even the governing body in the West Bank is urging them to accept. I had a conservation with a friend the other day that I think was fairly telling, I will summarize it below:

Friend: Israel will never be able to get a lasting peace if they constantly overreact like this and continue to bomb civilians.

Me: What, in your opinion, is the appropriate reaction against an entity that denies your right to exist, and in fact was founded on a charter that calls for your destruction and death of your people, and launches thousands of indiscriminate rocket attacks against your civilian population?

My friend did not have an answer - do you?

I know some time has passed so I have the benefit of hindsight but I have to ask you if after seeing how this shook out if you want to change your opinion?

Your friend may not have been able to answer but my answer is a question...Who exactly is denying whose right to exist? Who has always relied on America to block any meaningful international recognition of "Palestinians"?...yes I put it in quotes.

Do you not see what Israel did to the Gaza Strip earlier this year as a reprisal? If that wasn't a reprisal then I don't know what is. This is critical because reprisals are illegal according to international law. It's a violation of Geneva 4.

You're right about occupation. What Israel is doing to Gaza is not an occupation by any definition I've ever seen but it is a quarantine.

One last question...how exactly did Israel identify targets in the Gaza Strip?

 

[Iolo2]

As is obvious, Gaza is a death camp waiting to get properly started, like the German camps before the War; the 'Israeli' Nazis can't get away with it yet, that's all.

 

[Cruella]

Just think how great the Palestinian land would be today, if they hadn't spent the last sixty plus years trying to kill the Israelis and poising the minds of their populace.

 

[Iolo2]

Just think how great the Palestinian land would be today, if they hadn't spent the last sixty plus years trying to kill the Israelis and poising the minds of their populace.

Aye - all the Palestinians dead, instead of just 2.000 murdered children!

 

[Aus22]

If Palestinians are not occupied why do Jews invade the mosque.

 

[Aus22]

Now some Arab fanatics have attack a synagogue. This is wrong, most sides should respect each other's holy places

 

[Iolo2]

Now some Arab fanatics have attack a synagogue. This is wrong, most sides should respect each other's holy places

Don't ever ask why it is happening - someone might tell you and spoil your blissful ignorance.

 

[remnant]

There are some situations which look dissimilar but have a common essence. Israel unilaterally withdrew from Gaza based on its own interests however noble the action was. It didn't grant independence to Gaza. They also maintain a punitive blockade which is an indirect form of occupation. The threat of military invasion hangs over Gaza like the sword of Damocles. I think it is unfair to hide behind legalisms as to what law occupation or the threat of it states.

 

[Gabriel_Bell]

I question the claim that God rewards specific tribes with gifts of real estate.

 

[mark francis]

I question the claim that God rewards specific tribes with gifts of real estate.

God's covenant with Abraham and the Jews was not so much a reward as it was a divine award for divine reasons.

 

[Stalin]

A good analogy is the occupation of france by germany in ww2.

Initially france with split into two zones, a german occupied zone and a collaborationist Vichy regime.

The problem with Hamas for the zionist settler project was that it would not be collaborators like the PLA, and
only took up the complete struggle after Baruch Goldstein went on a murderous rampage

"Hamas first began suicide attacks specifically targeting civilians in response to the Cave of the Patriarchs massacre carried out by the American-Israeli settler Baruch Goldstein, who on 25 February 1994, during Ramadan, killed 29 unarmed civilians by throwing hand grenades and firing at a group of worshippers during prayer at the Ibrahimi Mosque in Hebron.[150][151] There was a strong sense that the Israeli military was complicit in the massacre because Goldstein wore military fatigues during his attack and carried an assault rifle issued by the IDF, the nearby IDF forces failed to intervene to stop the attack, and indeed an additional 19 Palestinians were killed by Israeli forces in the riots that ensued in protest of the massacre.[151] Israeli Prime Minister Yitzhak Rabin condemned the massacre, but refused to withdraw Jewish settlers from Hebron, fearing a violent confrontation with the settler community.[121] Hamas announced that if Israel did not discriminate between "fighters and civilians", then it would be "forced ... to treat the Zionists in the same manner. Treating like with like is a universal principle."[152]

Hamas - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Baruch Goldstein - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Needless to say, this terrorist is adored by the zionist fanatics.

Hamas are no angels, but when it comes to mass killings, they have to take a back seat to the IDF.

Comrade Stalin

 

[Gabriel_Bell]

Holding 2 million people prisoner for 60 years as Israel has done in Gaza tends to piss Palestinians off. How would you feel if you could not leave the five of six counties around where you live. So the Palestinians did not try to stop Hamas from firing rockets, and perhaps many of them felt like the Oct 7th attack was deserved, considering what the far more oppressive recent Netanyahu government was planning. 1500 Israelis were killed, and thus far 25000 Palestinians, most of them NOT members of Hamas were killed and 80% of the homes were destroyed.

Neither side is the right side in this mess, I do not wish to support it with my taxes.