Just give them the shot?

[Dr.Who]

About 600,000 people in this country are homeless. A small number out of 360 million but still a problem.

About 200,000 of them have a very private but very real illness called mental illness, one of the most common being schizophrenia. Being this sick they cannot hold jobs or even function in society, it is in all likelihood the cause of their homelessness.

Many of them do not and cannot realize they are sick because the illness affects their brain's frontal-lobe function, which is necessary to make that determination. Because they do not know they are sick, they refuse medication and often deteriorate. The neurological term for this is "anosognosia," derived from the Greek for "loss of knowledge”

As long as they are not dangerous they have every right to refuse medication, but that means that they won't realize they are sick.

If they do become dangerous they can be admitted to a hospital where they might be given a shot of the very powerful Haldol which can restore "sanity" in a short period of time.

If the police were to just round up the homeless, restrain them in an ambulance, and inject Haldol into their bloodstream through some strategic location on their bodies, we could allow them to understand that they are sick and greatly reduce a major major cause of homelessness. Consider that homelessness might be reduced from 600,000 to 400,00 in one fell swoop.

So, should a person's right to self determination and to refuse medication be respected or should they be forced to take it?

 

[PLC1]

About 600,000 people in this country are homeless. A small number out of 360 million but still a problem.

About 200,000 of them have a very private but very real illness called mental illness, one of the most common being schizophrenia. Being this sick they cannot hold jobs or even function in society, it is in all likelihood the cause of their homelessness.

Many of them do not and cannot realize they are sick because the illness affects their brain's frontal-lobe function, which is necessary to make that determination. Because they do not know they are sick, they refuse medication and often deteriorate. The neurological term for this is "anosognosia," derived from the Greek for "loss of knowledge”

As long as they are not dangerous they have every right to refuse medication, but that means that they won't realize they are sick.

If they do become dangerous they can be admitted to a hospital where they might be given a shot of the very powerful Haldol which can restore "sanity" in a short period of time.

If the police were to just round up the homeless, restrain them in an ambulance, and inject Haldol into their bloodstream through some strategic location on their bodies, we could allow them to understand that they are sick and greatly reduce a major major cause of homelessness. Consider that homelessness might be reduced from 600,000 to 400,00 in one fell swoop.

So, should a person's right to self determination and to refuse medication be respected or should they be forced to take it?

I'd say no, as long as they aren't a danger to others, they shouldn't be forced to take anything.

A lot of them are also homeless due to drug addiction. There again, we shouldn't try to force anyone to give up their addictions. Laws aimed at doing so don't work anyway.

What should be available to the homeless is treatment for drug addiction and for mental disease should they seek it.

If they don't seek it, then it can't be imposed on them anyway.

 

[pocketfullofshells]

About 600,000 people in this country are homeless. A small number out of 360 million but still a problem.

About 200,000 of them have a very private but very real illness called mental illness, one of the most common being schizophrenia. Being this sick they cannot hold jobs or even function in society, it is in all likelihood the cause of their homelessness.

Many of them do not and cannot realize they are sick because the illness affects their brain's frontal-lobe function, which is necessary to make that determination. Because they do not know they are sick, they refuse medication and often deteriorate. The neurological term for this is "anosognosia," derived from the Greek for "loss of knowledge”

As long as they are not dangerous they have every right to refuse medication, but that means that they won't realize they are sick.

If they do become dangerous they can be admitted to a hospital where they might be given a shot of the very powerful Haldol which can restore "sanity" in a short period of time.

If the police were to just round up the homeless, restrain them in an ambulance, and inject Haldol into their bloodstream through some strategic location on their bodies, we could allow them to understand that they are sick and greatly reduce a major major cause of homelessness. Consider that homelessness might be reduced from 600,000 to 400,00 in one fell swoop.

So, should a person's right to self determination and to refuse medication be respected or should they be forced to take it?

you could, but republicans would never pay the bill to actually help them after they got that little thing of sanity anyway.

 

[Dr.Who]

I'd say no, as long as they aren't a danger to others, they shouldn't be forced to take anything.

Then you respect their right to self-determination pretty strongly - strongly enough that you are willing to allow them to continue being mentally ill and homeless.

 

[pocketfullofshells]

Then you respect their right to self-determination pretty strongly - strongly enough that you are willing to allow them to continue being mentally ill and homeless.

do you think medical treatment should be given to people who refuse because they think they can pray it away? They are just as delusional in my view.

 

[PLC1]

Then you respect their right to self-determination pretty strongly - strongly enough that you are willing to allow them to continue being mentally ill and homeless.

Their homelessness is a direct result of their mental illnesses and/or addictions. If they aren't willing to change, then no one can impose a change on them. Drugging people to make them appear to be "normal" is abhorrent, IMO.

 

[Dr.Who]

do you think medical treatment should be given to people who refuse because they think they can pray it away? They are just as delusional in my view.

A nice comparison and no I would not force either the mentally ill nor those wanting a different cure to receive medical care they do not want.

Every person with self-determination should be allowed to refuse medical care they do not want.

 

[Dr.Who]

Their homelessness is a direct result of their mental illnesses and/or addictions. If they aren't willing to change, then no one can impose a change on them. Drugging people to make them appear to be "normal" is abhorrent, IMO.

I like how you saw beyond whether or not it was just a drug and saw that it was about imposing change. It would not matter if it were a shot or if it were ten sessions with a shrink. I also like how you saw that not being schizophrenic is to a degree about appearing normal rather than just a question of being sick or healthy. The right to control one's own body and possessions is exactly what the framers had in mind when they wrote that each persons right included the right to the pursuit of happiness.

(As a side note I have hired a person to work for me doing some jobs for about two years now and as a professional it is clear beyond a doubt that he is schizophrenic. He on the other hand is more convinced than I that he is experiencing the results of mind control by a selection of people who run the world. He does great work and he is happy as he is. I asked him once if he could take a pill that would stop the mind control would he, and he said he would not. The voices in his head bother him and distract him from his work but he seems to feel that there is a larger benevolent purpose at work. Whether he is right or wrong, as long as he does not try to harm me, I do not think it is my place to push medicine on him.)