Are we living in the Biblical End times?

[invest07]

2 Timothy 3:2 - For men will be lovers of self, lovers of money, uplifted in pride, given to bitter words, going against the authority of their fathers, never giving praise, having no religion.

1. Are we really living in the final generation?
2. Are Biblical prophecies about the End Times now being fulfilled?
3. What the heck does all that weird stuff in the book of Revelation mean for those of us living in 2007 AD?
4. Is the rise of Islamo-Fascism related to end times?
5. Does the United Nations really represent the prophesied One World Government?
6. Is the European Union the ten horns of Revelation?
7. Should we interpret Revelation and Daniel and Ezekiel literally or is all this symbolic?
8. If this is indeed the final generation, what exactly does this mean?
9. Does anything come after the final generation?

I believe we may very well be living in the Biblical End Times prophecied by Daniel and Ezekiel and Isaiah and Jesus. Christian believers in every generation since the death of Jesus have wondered if they are the final generation but I believe an event occurred on May 14, 1948, that signaled the beginning of End Times. That event was the founding of the State of Israel. Jerusalem fell to Babylon in 586 BC and the Jews have not existed as a nation since that time, until the State of Israel was founded.
I believe this founding was a fulfillment of Ezekiel 37:1-6 (the Dry bones vision). End times prophecies in the Bible refer to Israel as existing during the end times as a sovereign nation. So, the founding of the State of Israel seems to signal the official kickoff of End Times.

If you want to discuss any aspect of this, please join in. Atheists, agnostics, God Deniers, Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus, ad infinitum, are all welcome but please be respectful of everyone’s beliefs. If you disagree or think someone is full of Bull, please state your reasons in a dispassionate and scholarly manner without demeaning the poster’s beliefs.

One World Government

One of the most important elements of End Times prophecy is a One World government. This means the people of earth will have to give up their national sovereignity and join a world body. While this sounds noble and idealistic it is my opinion this would be disastrous. There must be very strong motivation for a sovereign people to even consider giving up that sovereignty. It means giving up our courts and our taxes and submitting to foreign laws. We would be surrendering the rights we have fought so hard for.

13 countries in Europe have already taken the first step in this direction (the EU and Euro currency). Are we (the US) already on the path to a global government?

Is the proposed North American Union of Canada, US and Mexico a step in this direction? Does the utter failure of GWB and the Feds to seal the southern border make this Union more predictable?
Does the highway from Mexico to Canada lay the ground for the NAU?
And what about the SPP pact? Doesn’t SPP requires us to surrender some national sovereignty?
Is all this laying the groundwork for the one world government prophesied in the Bible?

What do you see in the headlines today that may be indicative of End Times?
Did the events of 9/11/2001 lay the groundwork for End Times?
Is the rise in influence of pop culture or atheism or socialism/communism a sign of End Times?
Are the huge political and philosophical differences present today to be expected or are there greater forces at work?

 

[invest07]

The veracity of the Bible

The Bible is the most thoroughly documented text from the ancient world. There are several hundred original manuscripts of the New Testament in existence today. The exact text of the Old Testament was verified word for word with the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls in 1948. By comparison, there are fewer than 10 original manuscripts of Homer existing today. The Bible was written over a period of 1500 years by 40 or so authors. The Bible includes works of poetry, wisdom, history and prophecy. The Bible’s presentation of history has been challenged many times and has always been verified as accurate in the long run. Recently, the Pool of Siloam was discovered in Jerusalem, in exactly the location described in the book of John, in spite of secular archaeologists discounting it’s existence for years. “Scholars have said that there wasn't a Pool of Siloam and that John was using a religious conceit" to illustrate a point, said New Testament scholar James H. Charlesworth of the Princeton Theological Seminary. "Now we have found the Pool of Siloam … exactly where John said it was." A gospel that was thought to be "pure theology is now shown to be grounded in history," he said.
http://www.bibleplaces.com/poolofsiloamanalysis.htm

Many prophecies from the Bible have already been fulfilled. One of the more remarkable prophecies is in Daniel 2 and Daniel 9. King Nebuchadnezzar has a disturbing dream. Daniel’s interpretation of that dream about 600 BC correctly predicts:

1. The fall of Babylon to the Medo-Persian empire (538 BC)
2. The rise of Alexander the Great (beginning 336 BC)
3. The division of Alexander’s empire by his generals into 4 empires after his death
4. The rise of the Roman Empire (beginning 70 BC) and
5. The rise of a future End Times Roman Empire.

Secular historians are still scratching their heads trying to figure out how Daniel knew all this. This prophecy was 100% correct for #1, 2, 3 and 4 above, then why would it not be accurate for #5?

 

[vyo476]

I'm curious. What is your reason for posting this?

 

[9sublime]

I'm curious as to how you can refuse to admit to being a fundamentalist.

 

[Bunz]

invest, I think you are right, what can man kind do to prevent it from happening again? Or are there so many non-believers that it is to late and we will all feel gods rath, and just hope we are among the chosen few who actually get to live in heaven with God and his son Jesus?

 

[invest07]

bunz
Have you noticed how coarse our culture has gotten, over the past 30 or so years?

1. You now hear profanity and vulgarity in places you never did before.
2. Pregnancy out of marriage is the norm in Hollywood and Sports, rather than the exception. What is most troubling is the lack of public outrage. Oprah celebrates behavior like this rather than condemns it.
3. Tattoos used to signify crudity and roughness. Now they are "cool".
4. You hear obnoxious music blasted at 100db from cars in traffic.
5. Rap music lyrics use the same coarse language and degrading references to women. Again, where is the public outrage?
6. Television is a toilet. There is no such thing as quality writing. Only shock, sex and phoniness (check out Friday Night Smackdown for a mega dose of all of the above).

My belief is that these are all signs of the End Times. Reread the quote from 2 Timothy which I led off with. But my belief is that these things are inevitable and there is little any one person can do to reverse the course. There are forces at work that are bigger than us and those forces must run their course. This does not mean that we, (Christians, that is) should not resist and stand our ground. It just means that what is happening today was foretold a few thousand years ago and, over time, the forces driving the End Times will get stronger and more pervasive.

There is no other clearer sign to me than abortion. Our court system decided that the unborn's rights are inferior to the Mom's and that the Mom has the "legal right" to murder the unborn. So far the death count is 45 million and increasing at the rate of 3,000 per day. Worldwide the death count exceeds 100 million.

 

[Questerr]

bunz
Have you noticed how coarse our culture has gotten, over the past 30 or so years?

1. You now hear profanity and vulgarity in places you never did before.
2. Pregnancy out of marriage is the norm in Hollywood and Sports, rather than the exception. What is most troubling is the lack of public outrage. Oprah celebrates behavior like this rather than condemns it.
3. Tattoos used to signify crudity and roughness. Now they are "cool".
4. You hear obnoxious music blasted at 100db from cars in traffic.
5. Rap music lyrics use the same coarse language and degrading references to women. Again, where is the public outrage?
6. Television is a toilet. There is no such thing as quality writing. Only shock, sex and phoniness (check out Friday Night Smackdown for a mega dose of all of the above).

My belief is that these are all signs of the End Times. Reread the quote from 2 Timothy which I led off with. But my belief is that these things are inevitable and there is little any one person can do to reverse the course. There are forces at work that are bigger than us and those forces must run their course. This does not mean that we, (Christians, that is) should not resist and stand our ground. It just means that what is happening today was foretold a few thousand years ago and, over time, the forces driving the End Times will get stronger and more pervasive.

There is no other clearer sign to me than abortion. Our court system decided that the unborn's rights are inferior to the Mom's and that the Mom has the "legal right" to murder the unborn. So far the death count is 45 million and increasing at the rate of 3,000 per day. Worldwide the death count exceeds 100 million.

How can these signs show that our time is the most likely for Christ to return?

Don't you think the Renaissance with its rampant rape, murder, torture, pillaging, and pointless religious warfare would have made a better time?

I mean how can you even compare tattoos and loud music to the Inquisition?

And cursing is nothing new. Just because Hollywood tried to put a shiny face on culture in the 50's and 60's, the fact is that different curse words have been used by different cultures since the beginning of time.

Yeah God is going to end the world because of curse words, out of wedlock pregnancy (never that uncommon, you just used to have to marry a girl you got pregnant or her father would murder you), tattoos, loud rap music, and bad TV.

How freaking petty is God?

And by the way, how can you say this and then claim not be a fundamentalist in the Evolution thread?

Did you become an anti-evolutionist first and then a fundamentalist? Or did you come up with you anti-evolutionist ideas to back up your prior religious fundamentaism?

 

[9sublime]

I think the main objection with this I have is that I don't believe a goddamn word of the Bible, and even if the Christian God does exist, I don't want to meet him because, looking at the state of the world, hes obviously a class a tosspot.

 

[r0beph]

bunz
Have you noticed how coarse our culture has gotten, over the past 30 or so years?

1. You now hear profanity and vulgarity in places you never did before.

You now hear this where that you didn't before. This is such an open ended comment I really cannot warrant any validity.

2. Pregnancy out of marriage is the norm in Hollywood and Sports, rather than the exception. What is most troubling is the lack of public outrage. Oprah celebrates behavior like this rather than condemns it.

This is new? Albert Einstein's 3 children, out of wedlock. Many revered historical figures were born out of wedlock, Leone Battista Alberti, Leonardo da Vinci, Erasmus of Rotterdam, d'Alembert, Alexander Hamilton, Sarah Bernhardt, T.E. Lawrence, Stefan Banach, and Henry Morton Stanley. It is Not new in prevalence, nor is it really any more common than before, the only DIFFERENCE is the social stigma applied in contemporary occurrences.

3. Tattoos used to signify crudity and roughness. Now they are "cool".

huh? where in the world did you get this? The only reason there was even a Christian stigma with tattooing is that they tried illegitimize tattooing while trying to convert indigenous peoples who's culture including tattooing for artistic or spiritual reasoning. It never signified crudity...

4. You hear obnoxious music blasted at 100db from cars in traffic.

I doubt it's 100db, maybe around 45-60...

5. Rap music lyrics use the same coarse language and degrading references to women. Again, where is the public outrage?

where was the public outrage when christians beat their wives in accordance to the biblical scripture. Women are NOT equals according to the bible, the rap music is just keeping up with the christian way.

6. Television is a toilet. There is no such thing as quality writing. Only shock, sex and phoniness (check out Friday Night Smackdown for a mega dose of all of the above).

I agree the sexualization oiled men in speedos and the fact that people even watch wrestling may indeed be a sign of the end times.

 

[Coyote]

The great thing about prophecies is they're usually general enough, and vague enough that you are sure to fulfill them at some point

 

[SW85]

There's a Biblical End Times prophecy about a star called Wormwood exploding and blanketing the earth with poison. I read online somewhere that Wormwood translates into Russian as Chernobyl. Can't say if that's true or not, but if it is, I'd be more worried about that than a world full of tattoo-clad bastards.

 

[Questerr]

...

There's a Biblical End Times prophecy about a star called Wormwood exploding and blanketing the earth with poison. I read online somewhere that Wormwood translates into Russian as Chernobyl. Can't say if that's true or not, but if it is, I'd be more worried about that than a world full of tattoo-clad bastards.

Chernobyl translates as mugwort, which is a relative of wormwood but not the same thing. That is were the confusion comes from.

Not to mention, the prophecy specifically cites the star falling from the sky, which is definately not what happened at Chrenobyl. Nothing at Chernobyl fell, it just blew up.

 

[Bunz]

You now hear profanity and vulgarity in places you never did before.

Like where? Give me an example.

Pregnancy out of marriage is the norm in Hollywood and Sports, rather than the exception. What is most troubling is the lack of public outrage. Oprah celebrates behavior like this rather than condemns it.

At least in sports, I think this far from the truth. What gets reported, and therefore what you are aware of is the abnormal. Oprah is against god.
Am I the only one who has never seen a single episode of her show?

Tattoos used to signify crudity and roughness. Now they are "cool".

Tell that to the various groups of Polynesians who have been doing it for centuries.

You hear obnoxious music blasted at 100db from cars in traffic.

Would it be different if it wasnt music that you considered obnoxious?

Rap music lyrics use the same coarse language and degrading references to women. Again, where is the public outrage?

Where does this violate the 10 commandments?

Television is a toilet. There is no such thing as quality writing. Only shock, sex and phoniness

You can turn it the channel or off if you dont like it. I dont watch sitcoms, I leave my TV viewing to non-mindnumbing informational channels. History, science, discovery etc. No sitcoms or reality dramas for me.

(check out Friday Night Smackdown for a mega dose of all of the above).

LOL, I am out of the loop. I had to google it to find out it was pro-wrestling.
I dont know about you, but I grew out of pro-wrestling in the third grade. I dont watch it.

Invest...if its not to late to prevent God induced Armageddon, your TV and other media consumption habits are consumer driven. If you dont watch, advertisers pull thier money, the show goes away. In this day and age of mass media with as much competition among the providers. You as a consumer have quite a bit of sway in the content.

There is no other clearer sign to me than abortion. Our court system decided that the unborn's rights are inferior to the Mom's and that the Mom has the "legal right" to murder the unborn. So far the death count is 45 million and increasing at the rate of 3,000 per day. Worldwide the death count exceeds 100 million.

Are the various Christian churches going to pick up the slack they have given since R V. W came about with thier orphanages?
Because the Pro-life campaign and the right wing go hand in hand. The right wing would complain about the additional entitlement spending this would cause. Its a hypocritical unintended consequnce. I for one dont like the idea of abortion. But I will not stand in the way of someone who wants a safe procedure.
What do you think the death toll would be if we still had back alley and cotton field abortions as the norm. Both mother and unborn children?

 

[Castle]

One does not need to attach a religious prophecy to this to see an end game scenario beginning to play itself out in our time.

Throughout history the object of war was, in most cases, to win. In order to win one had to outlive one's enemy. To accomplish this the path was quite simple up until the end of WWII. Even in the cold war the threat of mutual destruction with the advance of nuclear weapons made it clear to opposing sides that a winning scenario was unlikely under the commonly held definition of victory.

Enter Islamic extremism. They do not need an expensive delivery system to get their weapons here. They are the delivery system and expect to be well compensated in the afterlife. Western society is not prepared to do what is necessary to counteract this new definition of victory. The question is, what will our response be when they deliver. Based on our current position, Im guessing it will be too late.

-Castle

 

[Bunz]

Castle, I dont see us nearly as close to an end game than we were throughout the cold war. A terrorist group having a nuke, getting it to the US and detonating it undetected is really is a long shot. A really long shot. Despite what the Bush administration would have us believe.