Will Obama Pass Amnesty Via Executive Order

Do you think Obama will pass amnesty via executive order and if so what will happen?

  • No, Obama will not pass amnesty via EO.

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Yes, Obama will pass amnesty via EO and will face impeachment.

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    3
If you wish to question my 'unsupported' arguments, it's really simple ... find facts that refute them. I'm not here to lead the lazy ... it's your job to get off your dead .... uhhh ... your couch and prove it wrong. Who knows? When you actually do some research, maybe you'll learn something - something that will prevent you from embarrassing yourself.

Now, as for your accusation - we agree the 3% was accurate .... then, this particular reference said that 27% of HOUSEHOLDS received 'major welfare' assistance. That's 'households', not people .... I don't think it's a far stretch to say that 27% of households would be equal to 40% of individuals - a number quoted often. Just for practice - YOU look it up --- it's easy. Go to google.com - search on "% illegal immigrants welfare". Be careful, though - prior to the current regime, the government actively prosecuted welfare fraud by illegals - DOJ has stated that they would no longer follow that law, so make sure your numbers are in the last 5 years.

The ironworkers in NYC?? I admit I didn't research that one ... I asked my wife's brother-in-law ... he's been doing it for about 15 years now. HE claims that most of the ironworkers on his job are either 1) illegal immigrants, or 2) non-union Native Americans. Then again, HE also claims he's making $38/hour - and I believe him - I've seen his house. (http://www.ehow.com/info_8339946_much-money-ironworker-make.html) shows that the average starting salary is $21/hour up to $44/hour.

If 'because I said so' isn't good enough ... prove it wrong.

Apology accepted.
 
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If you wish to question my 'unsupported' arguments, it's really simple ... find facts that refute them. I'm not here to lead the lazy ... it's your job to get off your dead .... uhhh ... your couch and prove it wrong. Who knows? When you actually do some research, maybe you'll learn something - something that will prevent you from embarrassing yourself.

Now, as for your accusation - we agree the 3% was accurate .... then, this particular reference said that 27% of HOUSEHOLDS received 'major welfare' assistance. That's 'households', not people .... I don't think it's a far stretch to say that 27% of households would be equal to 40% of individuals - a number quoted often. Just for practice - YOU look it up --- it's easy. Go to google.com - search on "% illegal immigrants welfare". Be careful, though - prior to the current regime, the government actively prosecuted welfare fraud by illegals - DOJ has stated that they would no longer follow that law, so make sure your numbers are in the last 5 years.

The ironworkers in NYC?? I admit I didn't research that one ... I asked my wife's brother-in-law ... he's been doing it for about 15 years now. HE claims that most of the ironworkers on his job are either 1) illegal immigrants, or 2) non-union Native Americans. Then again, HE also claims he's making $38/hour - and I believe him - I've seen his house. (http://www.ehow.com/info_8339946_much-money-ironworker-make.html) shows that the average starting salary is $21/hour up to $44/hour.

If 'because I said so' isn't good enough ... prove it wrong.

Apology accepted.
When you make statements, it's up to you to support them, not me. Because you say so isn't good enough, and it's not up to me to support or refute them.

Actually, one of your statements did turn out to be correct, which was a surprise to me. The illegals here in this part of the country are largely agricultural workers. It appears that's not a general rule. OK, point made.

As for illegals on welfare, that one didn't pan out so well. Anyway, your argument was that legal immigrants and citizens won't do field work because it's easier to live off of the dole, correct?

If illegals are also living off of welfare of one sort or another, then it follows that they wouldn't be willing to work the fields either.

and your source didn't back up your statement, not on that one.
 
When you make statements, it's up to you to support them, not me. Because you say so isn't good enough, and it's not up to me to support or refute them.

Actually, one of your statements did turn out to be correct, which was a surprise to me. The illegals here in this part of the country are largely agricultural workers. It appears that's not a general rule. OK, point made.

As for illegals on welfare, that one didn't pan out so well. Anyway, your argument was that legal immigrants and citizens won't do field work because it's easier to live off of the dole, correct?

If illegals are also living off of welfare of one sort or another, then it follows that they wouldn't be willing to work the fields either.

and your source didn't back up your statement, not on that one.

Actually, that explains why only 2% are doing field work ...

I have no interest in doing your research ... you don't like what I say, prove it wrong. If you can't prove it wrong ....

Your failure to grasp the basic mathematics does not constitute proving my statement false ... simply, prove it.
 
Actually, that explains why only 2% are doing field work ...

I have no interest in doing your research ... you don't like what I say, prove it wrong. If you can't prove it wrong ....

Your failure to grasp the basic mathematics does not constitute proving my statement false ... simply, prove it.
Once again, it's not up to me to prove your statements wrong. It's up to you to show that they're right.

Now, back to the original question: why is it no one is actually doing anything (as opposed to making mouth noises) about ending illegal immigration?

My contention was that it is because the employers of illegals like the cheap labor.

You already showed that illegals are paid less than legals.

Therefore, you're supporting my argument.

Now, if you're going to try to argue that illegals are coming here for welfare, then you need to show that. Moreover, if that's really why they're coming, then it follows that someone would be actually trying to end illegal immigration. Logically, the liberals would want to end it in order to preserve the welfare state for the rest of us. Conservatives, if there actually are any in Washington, would be trying to end it in order to save money.

But the indisputable fact in all of this is that the Democrats have been in power, and the Republicans have been in power, that is to say, in control of the White House and both houses of Congress, and neither one did squat to end illegal immigration.

Why do you think that is? Do you have any back up for your answer? You've so far done a great job of backing up my opinion.
 
Once again, it's not up to me to prove your statements wrong. It's up to you to show that they're right.

Now, back to the original question: why is it no one is actually doing anything (as opposed to making mouth noises) about ending illegal immigration?

My contention was that it is because the employers of illegals like the cheap labor.

You already showed that illegals are paid less than legals.

Therefore, you're supporting my argument.

Now, if you're going to try to argue that illegals are coming here for welfare, then you need to show that. Moreover, if that's really why they're coming, then it follows that someone would be actually trying to end illegal immigration. Logically, the liberals would want to end it in order to preserve the welfare state for the rest of us. Conservatives, if there actually are any in Washington, would be trying to end it in order to save money.

But the indisputable fact in all of this is that the Democrats have been in power, and the Republicans have been in power, that is to say, in control of the White House and both houses of Congress, and neither one did squat to end illegal immigration.

Why do you think that is? Do you have any back up for your answer? You've so far done a great job of backing up my opinion.

I guess you haven't been paying attention, huh?

The discussion was not about why illegals came here ... we all know the reasons.

The discussion was about what the current administration has done to encourage, facilitate, and condone the flow of illegal immigrants.

The point that I made, with specific regard to welfare, was that the current administration made a very public pronouncement that it was no longer going to prosecute welfare fraud by illegal immigrants, and that action has, among others, contributed to the increased illegal immigrant flow.

By the way, since you obviously are too intellectually lazy to do your own research (but would rather sit on the side of the road and throw peanuts at the parade going by), I suggest you review the Center for Immigration Studies, April 2011.

In addition, Judicial Watch had this to say: "Census Bureau data reveals that most U.S. families headed by illegal immigrants use taxpayer-funded welfare programs on behalf of their American-born anchor babies.Even before the recession, immigrant households with children used welfare programs at consistently higher rates than natives, according to the extensive census data collected and analyzed by a nonpartisanWashington D.C. group dedicated to researching legal and illegal immigration in the U.S. ... [T]he majority of households across the country benefitting from publicly-funded welfare programs are headed by immigrants, both legal and illegal. States where immigrant households with children have the highest welfare use rates are Arizona (62%), Texas, California and New York with 61% each and Pennsylvania(59%).The study focused on eight major welfare programs that cost the government $517 billion the year they were examined."

or, perhaps, this story about LA County

Los Angeles County officials believe that by the end of 2013 illegal immigrant parents will have received $650 million in welfare benefits for their native-born children, according to a CBS Los Angeles report.

Los Angeles County Supervisor Michael D. Antonovich has revealed the most recent Department of Public Works figures showing that through July $376 million in CalWORKS benefits and food stamps have been paid out to illegal immigrant parents, the CBS affiliate reports.

According to the report, about 100,000 children of 60,000 illegal immigrant parents receive about $54 million in welfare payments a month — $20 million in CalWORKs benefits and $34 million in food stamps — up from $53 million in July 2012.

“When you add the $550 million for public safety and nearly $500 million for healthcare, the total cost for illegal immigrants to county taxpayers exceeds $1.6 billion dollars a year,” CBS Los Angeles quoted Antonovich.

“These costs do not even include the hundreds of millions of dollars spent annually for education,” he added.


Now, in order to make it even intellectually easier for you, from http://www.thenewamerican.com/usnew...al-aliens-a-drain-on-us-taxpayers-report-says

Illegals live in poverty at high rates because they earn much less money compared to Americans. The average household income for illegals is $49,191. For Americans, it is $68,361, a difference of about $19,000. The difference in median income between illegals and Americans, just below $15,000, is less but still significant. The median income for illegal household is $35,755, for Americans, $50,437.


The per-person household incomes show a similar disparity. The average for illegals is $12,991. For Americans, it is $28,185, a difference of about $15,000. The median was $9,443 for illegals versus $20,795 for Americans, a difference of $11,352.


Welfare


Given that illegals tend to earn less money and live in poverty, they are also prone to use welfare. In Texas, for instance, 58 percent of illegal households collect some form of welfare, CIS reported, with 49 percent using food assistance and 41 percent using Medicaid. In California and Illinois, 55 percent use welfare. The list of states goes down from there.


Nationally, 47 percent of illegals use welfare; 39 percent use food assistance and 35 percent use Medicaid.


Is there anything else I can do for you? Shine your shoes? Wash your car?

You chose to accept what you THOUGHT you had heard from obviously biased sources, and disregard anything that MIGHT have disagreed with your preconceived assumption, rather than do an intellectually vigorous validation of your assumptions. You ASSUMED you were right, and ergo, I must be wrong, rather than accept the remote possibility that you might just have, somehow, somewhere, made a mistake.
 
I guess you haven't been paying attention, huh?

The discussion was not about why illegals came here ... we all know the reasons.

The discussion was about what the current administration has done to encourage, facilitate, and condone the flow of illegal immigrants.

The point that I made, with specific regard to welfare, was that the current administration made a very public pronouncement that it was no longer going to prosecute welfare fraud by illegal immigrants, and that action has, among others, contributed to the increased illegal immigrant flow.

By the way, since you obviously are too intellectually lazy to do your own research (but would rather sit on the side of the road and throw peanuts at the parade going by), I suggest you review the Center for Immigration Studies, April 2011.

In addition, Judicial Watch had this to say: "Census Bureau data reveals that most U.S. families headed by illegal immigrants use taxpayer-funded welfare programs on behalf of their American-born anchor babies.Even before the recession, immigrant households with children used welfare programs at consistently higher rates than natives, according to the extensive census data collected and analyzed by a nonpartisanWashington D.C. group dedicated to researching legal and illegal immigration in the U.S. ... [T]he majority of households across the country benefitting from publicly-funded welfare programs are headed by immigrants, both legal and illegal. States where immigrant households with children have the highest welfare use rates are Arizona (62%), Texas, California and New York with 61% each and Pennsylvania(59%).The study focused on eight major welfare programs that cost the government $517 billion the year they were examined."

or, perhaps, this story about LA County
Los Angeles County officials believe that by the end of 2013 illegal immigrant parents will have received $650 million in welfare benefits for their native-born children, according to a CBS Los Angeles report.

Los Angeles County Supervisor Michael D. Antonovich has revealed the most recent Department of Public Works figures showing that through July $376 million in CalWORKS benefits and food stamps have been paid out to illegal immigrant parents, the CBS affiliate reports.

According to the report, about 100,000 children of 60,000 illegal immigrant parents receive about $54 million in welfare payments a month — $20 million in CalWORKs benefits and $34 million in food stamps — up from $53 million in July 2012.

“When you add the $550 million for public safety and nearly $500 million for healthcare, the total cost for illegal immigrants to county taxpayers exceeds $1.6 billion dollars a year,” CBS Los Angeles quoted Antonovich.

“These costs do not even include the hundreds of millions of dollars spent annually for education,” he added.


Now, in order to make it even intellectually easier for you, from http://www.thenewamerican.com/usnew...al-aliens-a-drain-on-us-taxpayers-report-says

Illegals live in poverty at high rates because they earn much less money compared to Americans. The average household income for illegals is $49,191. For Americans, it is $68,361, a difference of about $19,000. The difference in median income between illegals and Americans, just below $15,000, is less but still significant. The median income for illegal household is $35,755, for Americans, $50,437.

The per-person household incomes show a similar disparity. The average for illegals is $12,991. For Americans, it is $28,185, a difference of about $15,000. The median was $9,443 for illegals versus $20,795 for Americans, a difference of $11,352.

Welfare

Given that illegals tend to earn less money and live in poverty, they are also prone to use welfare. In Texas, for instance, 58 percent of illegal households collect some form of welfare, CIS reported, with 49 percent using food assistance and 41 percent using Medicaid. In California and Illinois, 55 percent use welfare. The list of states goes down from there.

Nationally, 47 percent of illegals use welfare; 39 percent use food assistance and 35 percent use Medicaid.


Is there anything else I can do for you? Shine your shoes? Wash your car?

You chose to accept what you THOUGHT you had heard from obviously biased sources, and disregard anything that MIGHT have disagreed with your preconceived assumption, rather than do an intellectually vigorous validation of your assumptions. You ASSUMED you were right, and ergo, I must be wrong, rather than accept the remote possibility that you might just have, somehow, somewhere, made a mistake.

No, you don't have to do any of that. All you have to do is to back up your assertions.

Or, not be taken seriously.

Now, you did show credible evidence than only a small percentage of illegals were actually picking crops, however, that must be a pretty important small percentage:

Agriculture Industry Fears Disaster If Illegal Immigration Enforcement Program E-Verify Is Implemented

WASHINGTON -- The agriculture industry fears a disaster is on the horizon if the one bit of new immigration policy that Congress seems to agree on becomes law.

A plan to require all American businesses to run their employees through E-Verify, a program that confirms each is legally entitled to work in the U.S., could wreak havoc on an industry where 80 percent of the field workers are illegal immigrants. So could the increased paperwork audits already under way by the Obama administration.

See how I did that? I quoted a source, and posted the appropriate back up.

I could have just said, Hey, didn't you know that 80% of agricultural workers are illegal aliens?

But I didn't do that.

Now, let's look at another part of your response:

Given that illegals tend to earn less money and live in poverty, they are also prone to use welfare. In Texas, for instance, 58 percent of illegal households collect some form of welfare, CIS reported, with 49 percent using food assistance and 41 percent using Medicaid. In California and Illinois, 55 percent use welfare. The list of states goes down from there.

Which is exactly what I said: The employers of illegals like having them because they work for low wages. That the government is subsidizing those illegal employees doesn't matter to the employers.

Now, why are the illegals coming?

In order to make more money than they could in their own country, or
In order to be good little Democrats dependent on the welfare state?

And, we're allowing them to come because:

Obama (and all of the other presidents going back to Eisenhower) like them and are recruiting them to be good little wards of the state and vote for Democrats, or

Because the large donors like cheap labor?





 
No, you don't have to do any of that. All you have to do is to back up your assertions.

Or, not be taken seriously.

Now, you did show credible evidence than only a small percentage of illegals were actually picking crops, however, that must be a pretty important small percentage:

Agriculture Industry Fears Disaster If Illegal Immigration Enforcement Program E-Verify Is Implemented


See how I did that? I quoted a source, and posted the appropriate back up.

I could have just said, Hey, didn't you know that 80% of agricultural workers are illegal aliens?

But I didn't do that.

Now, let's look at another part of your response:

Given that illegals tend to earn less money and live in poverty, they are also prone to use welfare. In Texas, for instance, 58 percent of illegal households collect some form of welfare, CIS reported, with 49 percent using food assistance and 41 percent using Medicaid. In California and Illinois, 55 percent use welfare. The list of states goes down from there.

Which is exactly what I said: The employers of illegals like having them because they work for low wages. That the government is subsidizing those illegal employees doesn't matter to the employers.

Now, why are the illegals coming?

In order to make more money than they could in their own country, or
In order to be good little Democrats dependent on the welfare state?

And, we're allowing them to come because:

Obama (and all of the other presidents going back to Eisenhower) like them and are recruiting them to be good little wards of the state and vote for Democrats, or

Because the large donors like cheap labor?


You're quoting HuffPo as a reasonable source? And, moreover an article from June 2011?

Really?

Here's a news flash for you. E-verfy has been implemented around the country since 2011. Hasn't exactly proven to be "disastrous to the agriculture industry" has it now?

But, then again .... when have ultra liberal sources ever been accurate about anything?

And, if you think Obama is orchestrating these illegals to come here to work, you are truly delusional!
 
You're quoting HuffPo as a reasonable source? And, moreover an article from June 2011?

Really?

Here's a news flash for you. E-verfy has been implemented around the country since 2011. Hasn't exactly proven to be "disastrous to the agriculture industry" has it now?

But, then again .... when have ultra liberal sources ever been accurate about anything?

And, if you think Obama is orchestrating these illegals to come here to work, you are truly delusional!

I actually don't think Obama is orchestrating "these illegals" or any others to come here at all. I'm particularly sure that the ones who came here before he was elected weren't brought in by Obama.

E-verify has been "implemented"? Really? So, now the growers are no longer using an 80% illegal workforce, right? All those illegals have been replaced, then, by green carders or by citizens. Moreover, all of the other industries, where over 90% of the illegals work, have started using E-verify and so are no longer hiring illegals.

So, now all of the illegals are sitting home collecting American welfare and voting for Democrats.

Sure.
 
The illegal immigration issue in America. You may have heard that it’s a complicated and controversial matter.
It’s not.
It’s easy.
See, there are some topics here in the US that are unavoidably complex and therefore naturally contentious. Topics where right and wrong might be difficult to discern.
Illegal immigration, however, is not that sort of topic.
Illegal immigration is simple. Not simple to handle after decades of non-existent immigration enforcement, but simple to analyze. I actually do think Obama & Bush were orchestrating "these illegals" to come here By their lack of inforcement.
We have borders in this country. We have laws. We must enforce those laws and those borders. If someone comes here in a manner not consistent with our laws, we must send them home. If your first act as a would-be citizen is to defy our laws, you cannot be a citizen.
Simple. Obvious.
Every nation in existence has borders and laws, and every nation, save ours, generally goes about enforcing both. Mexico fortifies its southern border and has no patience or mercy for trespassers. If other countries don’t enforce their laws and borders, it’s most likely because they lack the resources and capabilities.
But here in this country we have a unique situation. We are able, but unwilling. Indeed, we may be the first nation in the history of humanity that actually has to argue over the basic concept of having and maintaining a border. Now we are dealing with a flood of third world illegals, prompting politicians and citizens alike to throw up their hands and say, “Well, I guess our choice to not enforce the border proves that the very concept of a border is obsolete. We have no other option but to become an amorphous blob of a geographical territory, virtually indistinguishable from the nations surrounding it!”
It’s really all quite insane. So I’ve decided to compile this helpful list to answer most of the questions and objections commonly raised by people who don’t understand why America should have laws and borders:

"-Isn’t it mean and hateful to deport illegal immigrants?

Great question. No.
I can only speak for myself, I suppose, but I’d guess that many anti-illegal immigration folks echo my sentiments: I don’t hate illegals. I don’t even fault them for trying to sneak across the border.

Despite popular perceptions, immigration enforcement is nothing personal. If I lived in Mexico, I’d sure want to leave. Some in the hordes might be unsavory characters, but many are, in fact, searching for a better life. I get it. I sympathize. But a man’s pure intent does not erase the law, nor does it negate the necessity of things like borders and organized, lawful immigration procedures.

A boy in the city might rob a liquor store because he honestly believes it’s the only way to help his mother pay the grocery bills. The fact that he committed this crime under duress and out of concern for his family may very well minimize his moral guilt. I’m sure that when he gets to those pearly gates, God will look upon him with great mercy and compassion.

Now, does that mean that we should erase the laws against robbing liquor stores? Is the liquor store owner now a bully and a fanatic if he takes measures to stop future robberies, even if those robberies are also at the hands of kids in similar situations? Should the police reward the young man by letting him keep the money he stole?
No, no, and no.
Why? Because, for one thing, that would be anarchy. For another, robbery is still objectively wrong. For still another, store owners deserve protection from the law. Without it, there can be no stores, and then we’ll all end up like the kid with the gun.

-Isn’t immigration enforcement a right wing conspiracy?

Interesting thought. But, as a member, I can assure you: the right wing in America can’t conspire to do anything. It couldn’t even conspire to win an election after four years of one of the most incompetent and disastrous presidencies in American history. I’ve been at the conspiracy meetings. Trust me, you have nothing to worry about. Half of the right wing conspiracy is still nestled close to Mitch McConnell’s bosom, smiling peacefully as he sings them to sleep at night. They are no threat to you.
No, this is not a right wing thing. This is a common sense thing. A country cannot exist without a border, and a border cannot exist without laws, and the laws cannot exist without enforcement. It’s very logical.
The true conspiracy is among those who oppose immigration enforcement. That camp can be easily divided into two factions (with plenty of crossover):

1) Corporations.
One of the greatest and most easily debunked myths in modern politics is the one about left wingers hating ‘greedy corporations.’ In truth, their social agenda relies on the strong arm unethical tactics of those corporations, and immigration is a perfect example.
Coincidence? Probably not.

2) Democrat politicians.
Sorry, not just Democrat politicians. I should say Democrat politicians and stupid, self destructive Republican politicians (a large group, to be sure).
Democrats own the Latino immigrant vote because they’re really good at identity politics, while Republicans are really bad at politics in general. They actively recruit illegal immigrants and fight voter ID laws because that’s how they win elections. Pretty simple. Illegals aren’t people to them, they’re voters. And, in the minds of politicians, there’s a profound difference between those two creatures.

-But what about the children?

Yes, the children. It’s always funny (in a morbid, nauseating kind of way) when progressives pull the “THINK OF THE CHILDREN” card. Apparently, in their view, it’s immoral to refuse children entry into the United States, as long as they’re attempting to enter through the southern border. However, if they wish to enter through their mother’s birth canal (a southern border of its own, you might say), we can not only refuse them, but suck their brains out of their skulls and incinerate them for fuel.
Perhaps we should think of babies as ‘birth immigrants’ and then they’d be protected from murder with the same fervor that we protect born children from being put on a bus and brought back to their families in their home countries.
I feel great compassion for these kids, but the law can’t be put to the side for them. Besides, maybe they’re better off elsewhere. We don’t exactly treat children with humanity and respect in this country.
Maybe we should concentrate on granting human rights to our own kids before we worry about granting citizenship to kids across the globe.

-America is a nation of immigrants!

Sure. And?
Most nations are nations of migrants. Very few people, no matter where they live, can trace their ancestry all the way back through the millennia to the very location where they currently reside. Humanity spread and pioneered and settled across the world. Most of us can follow our roots and find, buried somewhere deep, a nomadic heritage.
So what?
As far as America is concerned, immigrants came from all over. They settled here legally. They forged a life.
Things were different then. Notably, there weren’t as many people here. How is it that we hear so much about this mythical global overpopulation, but America is still viewed as the one place that can fit an infinite number of people? Of course, overpopulation is a ridiculous lie, so the problem with illegal immigration isn’t one of a lack of space. It’s more a lack of jobs, a lack of money, a lack of resources.
Not to mention, back in the old days, immigrants came here and helped tame the wild land. They pioneered. They dug in and did their part to build our once-great civilization. Illegal immigrants of modern times, on the other hand, are often coaxed over with Spanish language food stamp advertisements and visions of free education and free health care.
Our great great grandparents came to make this country. Many illegals of today come to use it.
I understand their desire to do so. I don’t fault them. But there is a big difference between then and now. A big difference.

-Isn’t it unfair to expect immigrants to navigate our immigration process?

Unfair? Isn’t it unfair to let them skip the immigration process while millions of others went through it?
Isn’t it unfair that legal citizens get treated like Osama bin Laden at the airport? Isn’t it unfair that the NSA has unfettered access to our phone records and Internet activity? Isn’t it unfair that you can’t even get your license renewed without producing five forms of ID, a vial of blood, and a stool sample? Isn’t it unfair that you are documented, tracked, counted, and monitored everywhere you go, all the time? Isn’t it unfair that it requires less identification to cross the southern border than buy cough syrup at Walgreens?
Yes, all of these things are unfair. Which means the immigration process isn’t unfair, because it’s very consistent with what the rest of us are dealing with on a daily basis.
Now, tell me that the bureaucracy is out of control and everything is more complicated and less efficient because of it, and I’ll agree. Tell me that we need to cut down the government and force it to handle its essential functions with speed and competency, and I’ll agree. Tell me that this should happen with our immigration process, and I’ll agree but insist that we start the streamlining process elsewhere.
In the mean time, open borders aren’t the answer. "
Open borders are never the answer. Unless the question is, “what’s the quickest way to bankrupt the country and ensure Democratic victories in every election from now until our society collapses and we turn into a lawless hell hole like Mexico?”
 
I actually don't think Obama is orchestrating "these illegals" or any others to come here at all. I'm particularly sure that the ones who came here before he was elected weren't brought in by Obama.

E-verify has been "implemented"? Really? So, now the growers are no longer using an 80% illegal workforce, right? All those illegals have been replaced, then, by green carders or by citizens. Moreover, all of the other industries, where over 90% of the illegals work, have started using E-verify and so are no longer hiring illegals.

So, now all of the illegals are sitting home collecting American welfare and voting for Democrats.

Sure.


1) Did you see a claim that Obama is orchestrating these illegals? What was said is that Obama's leftist approach to immigration management has been a significant contributor to the problem at the border.

2) As for E-verify - why would anybody use it when Obama's DOJ has announced that they have suspended enforcing the law?

3) As for the ".. all of the illegals are sitting home collecting American welfare ..." that's pedantic, and does discredit to any counterpoint you might have made. It was hardly the point of discussion, and your over-the-top comment contributes nothing.
 
[QUOTE="cashmcall, post: 229816, member: 3966"

Illegal immigration is simple. Not simple to handle after decades of non-existent immigration enforcement, but simple to analyze.[/QUOTE]

I'm reminded that someone once said, "No matter how complex, every problem has a simple answer. The answer is always simple; it's the implementation that's difficult."

Illegal immigration has a simple answer - stop it. Don't allow it. Don't create an environment that accepts it, or condones it, or even encourages it. Simply, don't allow it.How do we stop it? Again, the answer is simple. Don't allow illegal immigrants into the country - period. Close the door, raise the drawbridge, lock the windows - just, simply, stop it. If they are identified and apprehended, they are immediately returned to their own country. Simple.

But, they cry - most illegal immigrants just overstay their legal visas, and don't go home. Again, the answer is simple - monitor them, track them, create a weekly report-in structure, and remove them when the visa expires. Simple.

But, but .. we hear. Most illegal immigrants are valued, contributing members to our society. Again, it's simple. They're illegal. They should be sent home. In recognition of their contributions, we offer them a choice - become a visiting immigrant subject to all the reporting processes of those with legal visas, with automatic approval upon paying a fine of $xxxxx for violating our laws. Simple.

Make illegal immigration a crime (don't even go there about the current laws), make our police forces enforce the law, and the problem gets handled. Simple.
 
1) Did you see a claim that Obama is orchestrating these illegals?
PLC1 was probably referring to my comment.

I posted Obama was orchestrating the influx of illegals into this Country. I was referring to the article below. But, somehow, PLC1 thinks Obama's illegal actions are no different than any other US President in the past.

Liberalism ...... Go Figure!

Ex-border agents: Immigrant flood 'orchestrated'

'We are not gullible enough to believe thousands came without aid and assistance'
 
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1) Did you see a claim that Obama is orchestrating these illegals? What was said is that Obama's leftist approach to immigration management has been a significant contributor to the problem at the border.

Yes, that was Texas Tea who said exactly that.
And yes, Obama's approach has failed to solve the ongoing problem of illegal immigration.

2) As for E-verify - why would anybody use it when Obama's DOJ has announced that they have suspended enforcing the law?

The law hasn't been enforced for over 60 years. Why would such an announcement have any effect at all, even if it were made as claimed?

3) As for the ".. all of the illegals are sitting home collecting American welfare ..." that's pedantic, and does discredit to any counterpoint you might have made. It was hardly the point of discussion, and your over-the-top comment contributes nothing.

You may think that was a bit of sarcasm.
You could be right.
 
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