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Is Western culture being destroyed?

Discussion in 'World Politics' started by I-AM-THAT-I-AM, Jan 5, 2008.

  1. Mare Tranquillity

    Mare Tranquillity Well-Known Member

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    I find it interesting how frightened people always find things to be frightened of no matter how much the world changes. There has always been a boogy man out there that people can use to justify their fear and bigotry--Christ on a crutch! Read some history!

    And Christians are SUPPOSED to be on their knees!
     
  2. numinus

    numinus Well-Known Member

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    What an odd thing to say -- especially after john paul 2 message at the start of his papacy -- and, in hind sight, its defining theme.

    BE NOT AFRAID.

    You are truly funny, I can't help imagining you're a clown.
     
  3. Mare Tranquillity

    Mare Tranquillity Well-Known Member

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    You are judged by your works not your words. Anyone can make any kind of statement--Hell, look at the guy in the White House, but it's what you actually DO that really counts.

    In this case your attack on me personally shows that you have little of substantive to say.
     
  4. Coyote

    Coyote Well-Known Member

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    I can't help but think of this quote:

    What do I think of Western civilization? I think it would be a very good idea.

    Mohandas Gandhi
     
  5. numinus

    numinus Well-Known Member

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    LMAO some more.

    And jp2 said or did something that actually scares you, eh? Enough to coersce you to profess christianity?

    Nobody is forcing you to THINK anything (however absurd your thoughts are) -- least of all, christianity.
     
  6. bokile

    bokile Well-Known Member

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    The ‘End of America’



    The ‘End of America’ has come, warns a new book by a former US Presidential candidate named Patrick J. Buchanan, and who states:

    • Bush’s invasion of Iraq was a product of hubris and of ideology, a secular religion of “democratism,” to which Bush was converted in the days following 9/11

    • Torn asunder by a culture war, America has now begun to break down along class, ethnic and racial lines.

    • The greatest threat to U.S. sovereignty and independence is the scheme of a global elite to erase America’s borders and merge the USA, Mexico and Canada into a North American Union.

    • Free trade is shipping jobs, factories and technology to China and plunging America into permanent dependency and unpayable debt. One of every six U.S. manufacturing jobs vanished under Bush

    • “Sovereign Wealth Funds,” controlled by foreign regimes and stuffed with trillions of dollars from U.S. trade deficits, are buying up strategic corporate assets vital to America’s security

    • As U.S. wages are stagnant, corporate CEOs are raking in rising pay and benefits 400 to 500 times that of their workers

    • The Third World invasion through Mexico is a graver threat to our survival as one nation than anything happening in Afghanistan or Iraq

    * European-Americans, 89% of the nation when JFK took the oath, are now 66% and sinking. Before 2050, America is a Third World nation

    • By 2060, America will add 167 million people and 105 million immigrants will be here, triple the 37 million today.

    • Hispanics will be over 100 million in 2050 and concentrated in a Southwest most Mexicans believe belongs to them


    read this
    http://www.usapopulationmap.com/race_2090.html
     
  7. Mare Tranquillity

    Mare Tranquillity Well-Known Member

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    What an odd post. No, I don't think John Paul II said anything that frightens me, but your question highlights one of the most dishonest methods that Christianity uses to get converts: fear. If you can coerce people into "professing" your religion, then all you have are "rice Christians".

    Again no, no one is forcing me to accept their dogma though Christianity tries to do that to people (as you said). Christianity has become a religion based on fear, not on love as Jesus intended--that's why I quit the religion in which I was raised: fear and hypocrisy, intolerance and ignorace masquerading as piety.

    I whittled away at John Paul's encyclical and I have rarely seen a more self-serving piece of propaganda in my life. You talk about logic and reason, but there isn't any of it in his encyclical that I could see.
     
  8. numinus

    numinus Well-Known Member

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    You are a liar and there simply isn't any sense in what you are saying. Fear is the last thing christianity (at least, catholics) would be promoting -- especially when its leader exhorted -- be not afraid.

    And all throughout his ministry, jp2 has called and worked for inter-faith dialogue and understanding.

    It is right there -- the culmination of the entire western philosophical thought -- especially RATIONALISM.

    And if you can't discern logic in it, then you are simply beyond redemption.

    Then again, what can anyone expect from someone who holds homosexuality as a valid societal standard?
     
  9. Mare Tranquillity

    Mare Tranquillity Well-Known Member

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    I seem to recall that in the Bible it says that you are not in a position to tell someone that they are or are not beyond redemption. You don't come across as a very good spokesperson for your religion, your grasp of Scripture seems weak.

    Don't be so hysterical, Nums, you look silly with all that foam around your mouth. If you have free-will and some supernatural being tells you what you HAVE to do with that free-will or He will send you to Hell for eternal torment, then that supernatural being is using your FEAR of Hell and eternal torment to make you do what He demands. Christianity is a religion based on fear of Heavenly vegeance.

    I gotta tell ya, Nums, if that encyclical was the culmination of western philosophical thought, then we are in deeeeeep trouble. I mean look at the basis for Christianity: The belief that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was His own Father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and drink His blood, and telepathically tell Him that you accept Him as your Master, so He can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree... That's rational?
     
  10. Coyote

    Coyote Well-Known Member

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    Based on the ongoing conversations know Numinus is a practicing Catholic but I bet Mare Tranquility is an ex-Catholic.

    There are none so vehemently anti-religion as ex-Catholics.

    (I'm neither)
     
  11. 9sublime

    9sublime Well-Known Member

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    Fantastic!
     
  12. Mare Tranquillity

    Mare Tranquillity Well-Known Member

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    Actually, Coyote, I'm not an ex-Catholic. My problem with Christianity is that it no longer has anything to do with the teachings of Jesus. As a long-time student of the history of Christianity I also know that most Christians are sheep and know nothing about the history of their own religion.

    I do outreach in the gay and trans community and I see daily the terrible damage done to people by the hatred and bigotry purveyed by the people using the Bible as a weapon. I object to the stupidity and cruelty visitied on all of us by ignorant Bible-beaters. I lost both of my brothers when I transitioned because they are Christians and they say I'm a minion of Satan, but neither one can come up with a single Scripture that indicates any sin I've committed. Hello? There is not on single mention of transgendered people or about gender presentation in the whole Bible--we are persecuted by the Nums of the world because they are world-class ignorant of their own religion and so totally bigoted that they cannot learn. Other than that I don't have problem with them. Nums just happens to be an egregiously bad example and he's willing to keep exposing himself to my examination and comment.
     
  13. Coyote

    Coyote Well-Known Member

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    I don't disagree with you on a certain amount of hypocrisy in many religious faiths, it's why I've always been a cynic in regards to organized religion. You reminded me of two friends who were raised Catholic and are now athiest and another who came from a fundamentalist background. I always liked what Karen Armstrong had to say - all the major religions share a common base: compassion. It's unfortunate that many have forgotten that - not all but certainly those represented by the Phelps and Falwell's of this world.
     
  14. Mare Tranquillity

    Mare Tranquillity Well-Known Member

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    I very much like the teachings of Jesus, but I think a vast amount of the Bible is twaddle. For instance much of the Law of Moses was lifted out of the Code of Hammurabi, the genocide, raping the wives of vanquished foes, kidnapping virgins and raping them, selling children and others into slavery... all that is just nonsense and it's blasphemy to accuse God of saying it.
     
  15. Coyote

    Coyote Well-Known Member

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    I wouldn't say nonsense...like the Quran, it has to be read and understood in the context of it's times. Issac Asimov wrote a series of interesting books called the Bible as History which explored the historical aspects of it. They were quite good though it's been more then 25 years since I've read them. There's a lot of myth and there's a good bit of politicizing as well by the Church when it was consoledating it's power. It's got a lot of beauty too. I've always loved the Song of Solomon.

    I've never believed it (or anything) to be the literal word of any diety.

    If the word of "God(s)" exist(s) anywhere - it's entwined in the code of our DNA.
     
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